"Turkish" Tobacco Variety Map

[deluxestogie]

On this map, from Google Earth, I've place "push-pins" in the geographic locations that are represented by named Oriental varietal tobaccos. There are others. My purpose in creating the map was to lend some meaning to the host of odd Turkish names attached to Turkish varietal tobacco.

Bob

 

[DonH]

Very cool, Bob, thanks.

 

[Chicken]

i didnt see '' ottoman'' on there?????

i figured it would be in the general area of your map?

 

[deluxestogie]

i didnt see '' ottoman'' on there?????
i figured it would be in the general area of your map?

The Ottoman Empire, which finally fell apart after World War I, pretty much covered the entire area of that map. Today, what's left is called Turkey.

Bob

Decline of the Ottoman Empire (on http://www.naqshbandi.org/ottomans/maps/)

Another missing variety is Canik, which is located just a few miles south of Samsun.

 

[DonH]

What about Shirazi? I didn't see that on the map. Must not have been named for a town.

 

[deluxestogie]

Shirazi is named after Shiraz, which is a major city in southwestern Iran, and is not covered by that map. Although Shirazi is connsidered an "Oriental" tobacco, it's not Turkish.

Bob

 

[SmokeStack]

Great post Bob! As a pipe smoker, I was always intrigued by the elusive Turkish tobaccos. I did not realize that there was a city or region associated with each strain. It is very difficult or even impossible to obtain these tobaccos for pipe blending. Believe me - I called several tobacco companies and a plethora of retail stores. Mostly "generic Turkish" - a blend various Orientals that is usually very bland and sometimes Izmir or Smyrna that is nothing to write home about. I was told many times that these tobacco strains are no longer available because the growers make more money selling their Turkish to the big tobacco companies. Obtaining Turkish varietals was a thing of the past, until now...we can just grow it!

From what I understand, different strains of Turkish tobaccos can vary greatly in aroma when smoked. Some are said to be earthy or musty (kind of like Yenidje) and others are said to have a floral aroma when smoked. Would you by chance know/recommend a strain of "floral" Turkish strains?

I am growing Xanthi Yaka 18A, Izmir-Ozbas and Black Sea Samsun. Can anyone describe the aromas of these strains?

 

[BarG]

You guys need to know what your smoking if you want to be a conosieur? How is that possible for a retail product? I am playing a devils advocate here because how could you realy know what you were smoking? I suppose the highest end tobacco shops would stand on their reputation, but still would not tell you what you needed to know, to recreate that special blend.

For the record I am the last person to give advice on this subject.

Those are some great maps Bob and research. I had a great friend that would have been fascinated with this. I used to be really intrigued with that region from his prospective.

Armenia specificaly

 

[deluxestogie]

Although I have not grown Bursa, I have sampled some from FmGrowit. It seems to have a distinct floral aroma.

The aroma of the Bitlis from www.WholeLeafTobacco.com I would describe as similar to the distinctive "Turkish" aroma associated with Camel cigarettes.

Samsun is a bit stronger in flavor and intensity, slightly sweet, and also offers the "Turkish" aroma. Bafra comes across as a somewhat milder and subtler version of Samsun. Likewise with Samsun-Maden. All three are from the Samsun district of Turkey, as is Samsun-Canik. Trabzon is said to be derived from Samsun seed, and is reportedly much stronger.

My Izmir-Ozbas is described in a separate thread: http://fairtradetobacco.com/showthread.php?669-Rare-Turkish-Ootz-Cigar.

Xanthi-Yaka 18A (Yenidje leaf) can only be described as subtle and delicate. Its unique, lightly floral aroma is what gave the now extinct Balkan Sobranie White its unmatchable flavor. Xanthi-Yaka is a poor burner, and performs best when no more than 10 to 25% is included in a pipe blend. The Yenidje aroma shows though a blend that includes as much as 25% Latakia.

For all of these, leaving the plants un-topped produces milder, subtler leaf, with less floral intensity. Planting them closely (e.g. ~1 sq. ft. per plant) also produces more subtle--and smaller--leaf. These two practices lead to the opinion that Turkish tobacco is the mildest and most subtle of all tobaccos. When widely spaced, topped, and well fertilized, the leaf is significantly larger, but can become harsh, though not as strong as burley.

Currently, I am also growing Balikesir, Mutki, Smyrna #9, Tasoua and Yayladag. Of these, only the Tasoua shows a petiolated leaf (stem separating the leaf from the stalk, also know as basi bali or bashi bagli) like Samsun and its relatives. The others, with the exception of Mutki, appear to be basma types. Smyrna #9 produces the largest of the basma type leaf that I have grown in the past. Interestingly, the Mutki is putting out even larger leaves, and may represent a cross with a burley or a Spanish type (e.g. Comstock and Havana). If the Mutki smells and tastes "Turkish," then it may turn out to yield more Turkish leaf than all the others. I believe Ottoman is also a cross, perhaps with a burley.

I had seed for Celikhan, but it failed to germinate in several attempts. All of the others that I am growing should have seed available in the seed bank for next year.

Bob

 

[Jitterbugdude]

I'll add my take : The BSS-Canik I grew was totally tasteless and had a high nicotine content to it. The Ottoman-HY was rather bland but it gave a very big yield, hence the "HY" (high yield). Bursa is nice and flavorful with a noticeable nicotine content. BSS-Maden is more flavorful than Bursa and has less nicotine. It is my absolute favorite tobacco to smoke in a pipe. The variety from Lebenon (from our Egyptian friend) tastes just like BBB-Maden. I have yet to sample my Samsun -15 or Karabaglar but I'll let you know in the fall when I do.

Randy B.

 

[leverhead]

I have a question for the knowledgeable. I grew Black Sea Samson, Ottoman and Ottoman HY that may make it through the rain. Would the Samson make a good candidate for flue curing?

 

[SmokeStack]

You guys need to know what your smoking if you want to be a conosieur? How is that possible for a retail product? I am playing a devils advocate here because how could you realy know what you were smoking? I suppose the highest end tobacco shops would stand on their reputation, but still would not tell you what you needed to know, to recreate that special blend

Many tobacco shops (online and bricks & mortar) sell blending tobaccos for those pipe smokers who want to create their own blends. In the past (about 30 years ago and earlier) it was very easy to get all sorts of blending tobaccos. Nowadays it is virtually impossible to find Turkish varietals. They do sell Turkish blending tobacco as a "generic" form (a blend of various Turkish) but not separately as individual varieties. The generic form is usually very bland - most like a blend of Turkish hybrid tobacco.

 

[Rayshields]

You guys need to know what your smoking if you want to be a conosieur?

Before I joined FTT, I was a square dude...But now since I joined and have gotten to know guys like BarG, I am a suaave and deboner fellow, and a conizer of fine ceegars...

Taint prize arrived...thanks BarG...You have no idea how ugly a first ceegar can be...but it sure smelled and tasted good! That dark fire cured was so good that I nearly ate it.

 

[Jitterbugdude]

Would the Samson make a good candidate for flue curing?

Hard to say. There are many varieties of "Samsun" ,some have high sugar content, some have none. The Virgina type tobaccos that are used for flue curing have a high sugar content. I made some chew out of some Turkish and it tasted terrible. If you have enough extra tobacco to play around with give it a try/

randy B

 

[FmGrowit]

I grew Black Sea Samson, Ottoman and Ottoman HY that may make it through the rain. Would the Samson make a good candidate for flue curing?

Ottoman and Ottoman HY are the same thing...or at least should be.

I tested a bunch of fermented cigar wrappers from Indonesia over the past several months and I would bet they are an Oriental variety. I don't see ay reason you couldn't flue cure and Oriental...there's no telling what you'll end up with though.

Before I joined FTT, I was a square dude...But now since I joined and have gotten to know guys like BarG, I am a suaave and deboner fellow, and a conizer of fine ceegars...

Taint prize arrived...thanks BarG...You have no idea how ugly a first ceegar can be...but it sure smelled and tasted good! That dark fire cured was so good that I nearly ate it.

Sum of you guys are soundin mighty serfistercatered. Must be somethin in the water

 

[Chicken]

i may expand my turkish crop next year,

this year was a first for me on OTTOMAN,,, and BURSA,,, and im quiet pleased with the way the plant grows and the yield each plant gave me,.

ive grown SHARIZA last year,and wasnt very impressed with it,

thanks for the insight info , JITTERBUG, on the characteristic's of ottoman and bursa,

 

[leverhead]

It's amazing what adaptation, selection and a few hundred years can do to tobacco! My Turks flowered about a week earlier than everything else, if they'll yellow at a similar rate it might make a low risk test run really interesting. Even if it fails or shows little promise, I'm going to grow more varieties next time for sure! The deeper I get into this, growing to smoke keeps getting bigger.

 

[deluxestogie]

The deeper I get into this...

We should form a prayer group for those members who have succumbed to the temptation to grow too many new varieties. It is a toilsome burden to bear. Sigh...

Bob

 

[johnlee1933]

We should form a prayer group for those members who have succumbed to the temptation to grow too many new varieties. It is a toilsome burden to bear. Sigh...

Bob

Amen

J

 

[Chicken]

im doing a process of elimination, by growing 10+ varities this year,,,

to determine what will get cut from next years grow,

and what i want to grow more of, on next years grow,

hopefully in 3 years i'll have a patch with just 4 varities in it,,,, '' the 4 i like the most''