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UK Customs/UKBA - how to deal with them

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notcrack

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I've been having some really issues with customs lately (not on anything from Don, that sails through), so I thought I'd write a little thread to help out anyone else who might come up against these sods.

For anyone who is unaware in the UK we have the HMRC. They are a pretty fair and straight forward bunch of people to deal with and I've personally never had any real problems with them. I know some might come here and say they are as bad as UKBA, but in my opinion they aren't.
Anyway then we have the UKBA who are a branch of the home office. They are staffed by people who have very little grasp of importation law. These are the people that brand cross channel shoppers as smugglers for bringing in a few more boxes of cigarettes than they should. The limits of which are only a suggestion by the UKBA and not British law. They have stolen cars off of families and put countless people through court proceedings for breaking no law. They are the lowest of the low. I won't carry this rant on, but I think you get my point.

Today I had a little call off of parcelforce (the Royal mail's international delivery branch) saying that they had a package of mine that had been charged by customs. I asked how much, thinking it would be around £100 and I was told that is was £2,700. A little taken aback I asked why and I was told that's what the UKBA had charged it.
I then told the parcelforce girl (I actually lost my temper with her unfairly) that I was not paying such a fine and that I would talk to HMRC. I then had a 30 minute conversation with them and they told me that trying to import 10kg of processed tobacco was fool hardy and I was lucky I wasn't being brought up on smuggling charges. I told the woman that I would never import processed tobacco as it is fool hardy and that I would only import whole leaf unprocessed tobacco. I then had to go through the usual questions regarding what and why would I want whole leaf tobacco etc.
The woman then asked me to hold and contacted the UKBA. She came back to me and explained that I would have to get the correct commodity codes myself and send everything off to the UKBA.

So here is how you get all the information you need to import a large amount of whole leaf tobacco into the UK.
You are asked to call the Tariff Classification Helpline (01702 366077) - once you're through to them you need to tell them what is in the package. Here are the codes
2401 10 35 10 - Light air cured Burley - Not stemmed or stripped
2401 10 35 20 - Light air cured Maryland - Not stemmed or stripped
2401 10 60 00 - Sun cured oriental - Not stemmed or stripped
2401 10 70 10 - Dark air-cured varieties - Not stemmed or stripped (this one is a little vague)
2401 10 85 10 - Flue-cured Virginia - Not stemmed or stripped
2401 10 85 90 - Flue-cured other - Not stemmed or stripped
2401 10 95 11 - Kentucky/Fire-cured varieties - - Not stemmed or stripped
2401 10 95 91 - All others - Not stemmed or stripped

Once you go through these codes with the classification people they will happily allow you to put there names against the letter you are going to send the UKBA.
Then you need to print off the invoice and send it along with a letter containing the relevant codes, tariff classification officer's name and the tracking number for the parcel.

I had to send my letter to -
UKBA
Coventry International Hub
Siskin Parkway West
Coventry
CV3 4HX

But you may need to send it elsewhere depending on what company has your package.

Anyway I hope this helps someone out as it's been a bit of a bugger getting hold of this info.

Kind Regards
Joe
 

notcrack

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Oh I should mention that this shipment was 20lb of Virginia flue cured and a few bags of random leaves. Nothing that huge, but this is relevant to any large import of whole leaf.
 

leverhead

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It sound like the UKBA is kind of like some of our (US) "bureaus". They get their staff lawyers to write findings that let them go off on their own, until a court stops them. It's law and order, so they get their bigger budget for next year.
 

notcrack

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I wish they were as official as that lever. They are just school dropouts with a badge. The amount of time I've gone through customs with a lot of tobacco and just blown their rules away. The UKBA have a limit of 200 cigarettes per person, but this is just a suggestion and not law, but if you try to bring more than that through they take your goods and you get branded a smuggler, but if you tell them that thats a suggested limit not a law they don't know what to say. It's quite funny. I do it on purpose now. There are whole English blog dedicated to making them look foolish. My favourite post was one bloke helping every passenger on a ferry from france, but you're right. The more busts, the more money next year. So bust they do. It's shameful actually.
 

BarG

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I wish they were as official as that lever. They are just school dropouts with a badge. The amount of time I've gone through customs with a lot of tobacco and just blown their rules away. The UKBA have a limit of 200 cigarettes per person, but this is just a suggestion and not law, but if you try to bring more than that through they take your goods and you get branded a smuggler, but if you tell them that thats a suggested limit not a law they don't know what to say. It's quite funny. I do it on purpose now. There are whole English blog dedicated to making them look foolish. My favourite post was one bloke helping every passenger on a ferry from france, but you're right. The more busts, the more money next year. So bust they do. It's shameful actually.
Its sounding all too familiar ? A regulation NATION.
 

BarG

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Shit John, I missed your 1500 post anniversary................ I think Dons new born Grandson may have trumped you.
 

Holysmokes

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Hi notcrack, thanks for the detailed advice and guidance on this.

I have just been hit with a £750 notice from HMRC for duty tax on whole leaf tobacco imported from the US.


I was wondering if you had to pay import VAT and customs charges on your whole leaf order or did they scrap all tax in the end?

Thanks
 

darren1979

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HI holysmokes. How much did you import? Sounds like they're trying to class it as rolling tobacco for the amount of duty asked.
 

Holysmokes

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9LB with a shredder. It's classed as "Tobacco Refuse" by law, and have read a few other places they seem to be doing this quite alot. Im unsure whether it is worth it if I have to pay customs/import tax as well though, may just be best to send back and order from a UK company.
 

Knucklehead

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9LB with a shredder. It's classed as "Tobacco Refuse" by law, and have read a few other places they seem to be doing this quite alot. Im unsure whether it is worth it if I have to pay customs/import tax as well though, may just be best to send back and order from a UK company.

All the UK and Canadian guys I've seen on here that chose to fight it have come out very good.
Post #1 lays out the steps to follow for the UK.
 

Holysmokes

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Hey Knucklehead, I am quite confident that the charge will be dropped on excise duty because the claim is based false premises. However, what I would like to find out is whether the customs charge and income tax are still applicable.
 

Knucklehead

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Hopefully our UK members will weigh in. Customs and income tax is something I don't have to deal with. Why would they charge an income tax unless you were selling it, and wouldn't that come after a sale?

EDIT: notcrack hasn't posted here since 2013, but he is Don's UK distributor. You can contact him through his website: http://pureleaf.co.uk/
I'm sure he can give you some current info and advice. (He's closed till after the 7th for Easter)
 

Holysmokes

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Cheers mate, I was thinking about contacting him anyway. I'm not sure as it's my first time buying whole leaf, can't seem to find any organic leaf in the UK and this was relatively cheap.
 

jojjas

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I think you should take the fight with the customs ,tell them that it´s whole leaf tobacco and should be classified as hs code 2401.10.xx.xx , if you bought it from WLT it should be labeled on the outside of the package whit the content and how it should be classified , and copy the link above .
I have a little bit of trouble with the customs the first times i bought from us , but since i tell them what it was and point out the specific hs-code to them , i don´t have had any trouble with them , it´s even easier now when i applied of an customer nr at the customs , they usually send the shipping direct to me with a bill of the correctly requested sum
As Don (forum owner and WLT owner) wright here many times , you have to teach them to do it the right way

You also might pay Vat and a small fee but i am not sure how much (i am from sweden) so i am not acquainted with the uk system
Good luck and go for it
Mikael
 

notcrack

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Hi notcrack, thanks for the detailed advice and guidance on this.

I have just been hit with a £750 notice from HMRC for duty tax on whole leaf tobacco imported from the US.


I was wondering if you had to pay import VAT and customs charges on your whole leaf order or did they scrap all tax in the end?

Thanks

Hi Holysmokes,

My apologies for not responding to this earlier, but I've only just seen the subscription email for the thread.

First things first is that you need to put yourself in the mindset of a UKBA agent and look at what you have imported. 9lbs of leaf and a shredder is going to be difficult to explain away as not for smoking purposes, but I like a challenge.

The first call you need to make is to parcelforce (I'm assuming they have the parcel) an tell them you are fighting the charge and you want them to hold the parcel over the 2 week cutoff. They should be fine with this.
You then need to call HMRC and get them to take the info for the UKBA because you're unable to contact them directly. I would say that you were importing the goods for the use as bird bed (bird parasites don't like nicotine) and that is why there is a shredder included. Only offer this information if they request it, but make sure you give them the full tariff code (2401.....) for each product in the box. Don't let that person off the phone without understanding that it is an unsmokable product.
After that call you should receive a call from the UKBA telling you what their decision is. What ever they decide is final, so don't even bother trying to fight it.

It is a hassle doing all of this, but 90% of the time they will release the package. Good luck, mate.
 
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