Tombac

[istanbulin]

Now, they're looking normal (spots, leaf shape). Strongness may change by growing regions. Although they are grown with same Persian (Isfahan) seeds Lebanase and Turkish tombacs have differences with taste.

When I saw the label, I knowed it's written in French but very familiar to English. I though that everyone could get the meaning. So I made a wish about Arabic.

 

[istanbulin]

I found a pic of Turkish grown tombac. Very large leaves.

 

[istanbulin]

This photo may be a clue about the origin of tombac. Look at these flower buds form, aren't they match with N. Rustica's ? Of course, flower shape and color is different. Also leaves are different, they're not glossy as rustica leaves. There might be a serie of cross-pollination, IMO there may be a N. Rustica influence on tombac.



BTW, I'm searching for tombac seeds.

 

[Boboro]

I do want to try to grow some tombac. Does it grow in poor soil with little water like other tobacco from that region?

 

[istanbulin]

I do want to try to grow some tombac. Does it grow in poor soil with little water like other tobacco from that region?

Bigger leaves are really desired for tombac, so grow them by the American style In poor soils and lack of water they'll give smaller leaves with lower nicotine.

 

[Boboro]

What is best for hookah?

 

[istanbulin]

What is best for hookah?

Of course, a big leaf full of nicotine is the best. Look at the photo above for the leaf size (a woman holding a hand of tombac). When it's grown like this (standart size), its nicotine content is about 3% generally.

 

[Boboro]

Ive tryed washing tobacco for shisha is That what you do with tombac. It ant necessary with silk leaf.

 

[skychaser]

"This photo may be a clue about the origin of tombac. Look at these flower buds form, aren't they match with N. Rustica's ? Of course, flower shape and color is different. Also leaves are different, they're not glossy as rustica leaves. There might be a serie of cross-pollination, IMO there may be a N. Rustica influence on tombac."

I think they look more like Simox, a Hungarian variety, than they do a Rustica. Flowers on Rusticas are even closer together and have a short stem on the pods. The leaves look more like Simox to me. Rusticas are a darker glossy green and the leaves are rounder or heart shaped. The flower head on the Tomabc looks like a Hungarian type to me too. They are much denser than other tobaccums, and are deep pink and often quite showy looking. Here is a photo of Simox from last year. Unfortunately, the flower is bagged and hard to see at all. But you can see the similarity of the leaves. You may have to copy and paste it into your browser for it to work because my server blocks certain types of hotlinks. http://nwtseeds.com/Simox_2.jpg And here is a photo of Aztec Rustica and its flowers. http://nwtseeds.com/Aztec.jpg

Hungarian tobaccos are Classified as Orientals, along with many Turkish varieties. They could well be related. Tobaccums and Rusticas have different numbers of chromosomes. Obtaining any sort of cross is very difficult. It is possible there are Rustica genes in Tombac, but I think it unlikely. Bob knows more about that than I do, so I'll toss the chromosome question and the likely hood of a cross over to him.

 

[skychaser]

The cured leaves in the first photo also look very similar to the leaves on Baiano, another Hungarian / Oriental variety. http://nwtseeds.com/Baiano2.jpg

 

[istanbulin]

Mine is just a superficial opinion.
My observations about differences between rustica and tombac are totally match with yours, unsurprisingly.
Tombac leaves have an obtuse leaf form, cured leaves may be confusing.
Hungarian varieties may be related with tombac, who knows.

But, N. Rustica and N. Tabacum both have the same number of chromosomes (24). But in Rustica subgenus like Paniculatea and Thyrsiflorae have 12 chromosomes. Also a Tabacum subgenus (Tomentosae) have 12 chromosomes. But N. Tabacum and N. Rustica both have 24 chromosomes. Even though they have different chromosome count, it's not a problem for a cross. There's a lot of studies about this. For example, a serie of cross pollination of N. Rustica (24) x N. Paniculata (12). They obtain fertile seeds and compared the shape of the leaves.

 

[skychaser]

Mine is just a superficial opinion.
My observations about differences between rustica and tombac are totally match with yours, unsurprisingly.
Tombac leaves have an obtuse leaf form, cured leaves may be confusing.
Hungarian varieties may be related with tombac, who knows.

But, N. Rustica and N. Tabacum both have the same number of chromosomes (24). But in Rustica subgenus like Paniculatea and Thyrsiflorae have 12 chromosomes. Also a Tabacum subgenus (Tomentosae) have 12 chromosomes. But N. Tabacum and N. Rustica both have 24 chromosomes. Even though they have different chromosome count, it's not a problem for a cross. There's a lot of studies about this. For example, a serie of cross pollination of N. Rustica (24) x N. Paniculata (12). They obtain fertile seeds and compared the shape of the leaves.

N Tomentosae and N. Sylvestris are the parental ancestors of N. Tobacum. Both have 12 chromosomes, and Tobacum was a one in a billion natural cross occurring 10's to 100's of thousands of years ago which yielded a plant with 24 chromosomes. But todays Tobacums are diploids with 2 sets of 24 chromosomes for a total of 48. How this occurred and how a diploid is created, I do not have a clue. Genetics is not my best area. But it is my understanding that this is why crossing Tobacums and Rusticas is very difficult.

 

[istanbulin]

N Tomentosae and N. Sylvestris are the parental ancestors of N. Tobacum. Both have 12 chromosomes, and Tobacum was a one in a billion natural cross occurring 10's to 100's of thousands of years ago which yielded a plant with 24 chromosomes. But todays Tobacums are diploids with 2 sets of 24 chromosomes for a total of 48. How this occurred and how a diploid is created, I do not have a clue. Genetics is not my best area. But it is my understanding that this is why crossing Tobacums and Rusticas is very difficult.

Yes, I gave the half count of the chromosomes because it was aboout the crossing issue. There's another point, N. Tabacum L. is tetraploid (2n=4x=48).

 

[SmokesAhoy]

that's interesting, if tombac is around 3% alkaloids that puts it in line with brightleaf. For those of you who really love turkish tobacco but find it too weak this might be the answer to the flavor and the alkaloid requirements

 

[istanbulin]

that's interesting, if tombac is around 3% alkaloids that puts it in line with brightleaf. For those of you who really love turkish tobacco but find it too weak this might be the answer to the flavor and the alkaloid requirements

It don't have a good aroma when you smoke it in a cigarette, also it don't burn well. Using tombac in hookah is enough for me. Formerly there was an snuff factory here, they were using tombac residues for making (dry) snuff.

 

[istanbulin]

Here are some new photos of tombac.


Seedling are growing.




Curing tombacs.




Tombac expertising.

 

[SmokeStack]

It don't have a good aroma when you smoke it in a cigarette, also it don't burn well. Using tombac in hookah is enough for me. Formerly there was an snuff factory here, they were using tombac residues for making (dry) snuff.

I have never smoked tombac in a cigarette, but it smokes well in the pipe with a little Latakia and some dark Virginia. Makes for a great English mixture or Balkan mixture. BTW Is an English blend synonymous with a Balkan blend or are they different?

 

[DonH]

I have never smoked tombac in a cigarette, but it smokes well in the pipe with a little Latakia and some dark Virginia. Makes for a great English mixture or Balkan mixture. BTW Is an English blend synonymous with a Balkan blend or are they different?

The way I understand it, a Balkan blend has more Latakia, as much as one half the total
mixture, and a good amount of assorted Orientals whereas an English Blend is mostly Virginia and non-Latakia Orientals with a smaller amount of Latakia.

 

[istanbulin]

All I know, they both have same types of tobacco (Virginia, Latakia and Orientals) but the main issue is their proportions. Also modern blends really lost their characteristics, they really have different types of tobacco today which were not existent in the blend before. Today it's really depends on the smokers palette which one is which. IMO, in an English blend I must feel Latakia strongly (English blends used to contain at least 40-50% Latakia). In a Balkan blend Orientals should be dominant, but Latakia must say "hi I'm here" with a noticable strong flavor behind them. I have no comment about VAs, IMO they're nothing than a filler in a pipe blend (of course, they're balancing the flavor).

EDIT: Because of the high demand of the Latakia tobaccos in the English blends, UK builded 8 tobacco factories in Cyprus between 1922-1960. According to the records app. 250 metric tons of Latakia were produced in Cyprus in 1949.