Tobacco Blocks in a Kiln

[AmaxB]

Has anyone tried pressed blocks or blocks of tobacco in a kiln?
If so how did it go and what was your result?

 

[deluxestogie]

I have kilned pressed blocks many times. There is no difference from the same tobacco kilned as loose leaf. The same has been true of tobacco kilned as a tied hand.

Bob

 

[Webby]

Has your kiln shrunk or is your garden growing, faf.
I had no problems with it the first time I tried in the oven kiln so have had a block in now 10 days. I also tried pressing 20 leaves with about 30kg for 2 days and then stacking in the kiln, both the block and the press were as good as the loose leaf that i have hung in the new kiln. Thing to watch out for though is drips of condensation on the block/pile. Lost half the 20 leaf experiment to mold caused by a drip.
Am thinkin of higher stacks when I get more leaf cured as I think I have a similar scenario to yours. Some feed back on stacks as well would be appreciated.
btw, the block i have trialed were 4.5 x 4 x 1.5 inch when pressed then they puff up a bit in the kiln.

 

[AmaxB]

Thanks Bob / Deluxe I had read this a few times and just wanted to ask and see what was said. As you know I have a large ugly pile now and was thinking of how I will load the next batch. Also wondered how it would age you have answered that for me. Thank you
Webby my pile is two really the first is pushing 3 weeks the second pile separated with a piece of rack is finishing the end of the first week. Has the pile swelled not that I can tell, I have no condensation drips other than some that runs down the face of the door due to it being metal. The first 2-3 days running it I put a wet towel over half the top of the pile. Think it was 3 days I checked it and wa-la I had mold under the towel and no place else.
From that point on I have had no mold issues but will get condensation build up in my duct line if I tune it so my vents don't open often enough. At the moment they open a bout once every 2 hours for about 5 minutes.
Your drip might get cured with more air circulation and or venting.
Think the next run will be a nice neat large stack.

 

[Webby]

Yea mate saw yours and looks surprisingly like mine. Have only one drip from the vent hole in the ceiling, would have vented through the wall had I known. The first compressed block and pile I done were because I was using an oven for a kiln and did not have much space. They came out very dark and sweet. A lot like cavendish I was told.

 

[AmaxB]

Yea mate saw yours and looks surprisingly like mine. Have only one drip from the vent hole in the ceiling, would have vented through the wall had I known. The first compressed block and pile I done were because I was using an oven for a kiln and did not have much space. They came out very dark and sweet. A lot like cavendish I was told.

This thread has been here awhile....
Have not done blocks yet webby but as you have likely seen am playing with piles

 

[Fisherman]

I have kilned pressed blocks many times. There is no difference from the same tobacco kilned as loose leaf. The same has been true of tobacco kilned as a tied hand.

Bob

How tite a brick did you use Mr Deluxe?

 

[deluxestogie]

How tite a brick did you use...

Stemmed leaf pressed 24 hours under ~100 pounds.

Bob

 

[Chicken]

id say it would do it,,, the leaf is cured before making a brick,

i'd think it would take a higher, heat/humidity ratio,

 

[Fisherman]

I made a 7 1/2" x 12" x 1 1/2" brick which weighed in at 4 1/2 pounds. Wrapped in a pillow case and strapped with fishing line.
I think I can get 3 such bricks in my little unit . Oh yeah I de-ribbed them also. This would be almost 1/2 my years needs for ciggerettes. Will post results soon . Machine is set for 124 deg F and moisture is not adjusted yet but have unit in mail for that . Will run at 75%??????

 

[springheal]

Love the idea of doing it in blocks as bulk lots can be achieved and taking up little space should the kiln be small. Not your issue AmaxB

@Fisherman. As you're set for 124 deg. I would think there's no chance of mold using brick method. Perhaps a little higher to be sure!?!
@Chicken. Higher humidity may end up with a collapsed block, turned into mush!?!
@deluxestogie. As you have kilned pressed blocks many times, can you please clarify temp/humidity values please for the newbie?
I do remember reading an old thread where a member was trialling the block method, however (after other members requests) he never responded with a final result.

 

[AmaxB]

My thought on the block is, If pressed moisture can affect the outer portions of the block but does it reach the inner area. Isn't it required to cause the aging / fermenting along with the appropriate temperature?
Or is it that the moisture is already there and is preserved by that of the ambient within the chamber / kiln as the brick is subjected to temperature? I also question the quality of the smoke through out the brick.
I can't help to think it would very.
As far as going to mush I don't think so, I do think it would swell.
If a box 18" x 14" x 12" were filled at start it will hold about 5 pounds after in the kiln a day or two another 3 to 4 pounds could be added. it settles.

 

[DonH]

My thought on the block is, If pressed moisture can affect the outer portions of the block but does it reach the inner area. Isn't it required to cause the aging / fermenting along with the appropriate temperature?
Or is it that the moisture is already there and is preserved by that of the ambient within the chamber / kiln as the brick is subjected to temperature? I also question the quality of the smoke through out the brick.
I can't help to think it would very.
As far as going to mush I don't think so, I do think it would swell.
If a box 18" x 14" x 12" were filled at start it will hold about 5 pounds after in the kiln a day or two another 3 to 4 pounds could be added. it settles.

I think Bob already answered your questions: It kilns just fine, there is no difference in quality from the outside to the middle, but you may want to add a day or two up front to get the block uniformly humid. The humidity and temp values don't have to be super exact. as long as they stay in the range it will be fine. This isn't chemical engineering, it's just aging tobacco.

 

[deluxestogie]

I'm not sure what you get with a huge block of tobacco. The humidity for aging just needs to be somewhere around 60% for it to progress. If the kiln is running between 120-130ºF, with a measured humidity in the 70-80% range, then apparently sufficient moisture makes it to the center (of my small books of leaf).

My take on the chemical situation is that it needs sufficient moisture to age, with higher not necessarily making it faster, but the process does go faster with increasing temperature (starting at about 60 or 70ºF, up to the mid 140's). The oxidase enzyme is destroyed at ~149ºF. Once it's gone, it's gone. My impression is also that temps above ~135ºF tend to darken the leaf color more than staying below 130ºF.

Bob

 

[AmaxB]

I think Bob already answered your questions: It kilns just fine, there is no difference in quality from the outside to the middle, but you may want to add a day or two up front to get the block uniformly humid. The humidity and temp values don't have to be super exact. as long as they stay in the range it will be fine. This isn't chemical engineering, it's just aging tobacco.

No I don't think it is complicated...Just have not done it. I don't doubt that it works am sure it does I just have this terrible tendency to wonder about the hows and whys.
Is sort of like looking at the big picture and ignoring the center if doing that you get the big picture but miss things along the way.

 

[AmaxB]

I'm not sure what you get with a huge block of tobacco. The humidity for aging just needs to be somewhere around 60% for it to progress. If the kiln is running between 120-130ºF, with a measured humidity in the 70-80% range, then apparently sufficient moisture makes it to the center (of my small books of leaf).

My take on the chemical situation is that it needs sufficient moisture to age, with higher not necessarily making it faster, but the process does go faster with increasing temperature (starting at about 60 or 70ºF, up to the mid 140's). The oxidase enzyme is destroyed at ~149ºF. Once it's gone, it's gone. My impression is also that temps above ~135ºF tend to darken the leaf color more than staying below 130ºF.

Bob

Was not thinking huge blocks the box thing was just to point out what a box might hold in pounds in relation to it's size.
Thank you for the answers Bob
Had not thought about making the process faster, I believe higher moisture may make it better but am not yet sure of that. I do know from the little I have done that the higher temperature will darken it I ran some at 145F and had it come out like Hershy Chocolate. I find what you have to say about time and temperature interesting. When you do yours what does it smell like near the end of the cycle?

 

[deluxestogie]

One thing is certain. The higher the humidity during the color-curing browning stage, the darker the leaf will become. I don't know the explanation for that. This only applies to color curing.

I don't know how to describe the aroma of the kiln near the end of the 30 days. I associate a raw, hay and grassy smell with unaged leaf. (I've never really appreciated an ammonia smell, except in leaf that has not fully color-cured.) Although it's barely noticeable early in the month--from outside the kiln, it vanishes entirely toward the end, and begins to smell like finished tobacco.

Bob

 

[AmaxB]

After reading your post #14 I decided to increase the ambient temperature of the batch I am doing currently which is just now in the 3rd week. The Tobacco temperature has been 111F - 115F I'll bring that up to the area of 130F so the ambient will be some what higher. The Rh has been 79% up to the last few days at which point I increased it to 81% and so I'll increase it some more to 88% - 89% through this 3rd week. If my outer leaf does not become to dry than the 4th week I'll bump the tobacco temperature up to 135F - 140F and see what happens for an outcome.
The raw, grassy, hay smell I agree is not aged as far as ammonia I have had it only with burley barn aged or not. I had asked about smell because with BL it goes in with a grass smell, than changes to a fruity smell, and changes again to a fine tobacco smell. Now with burley what little I've done to me going in it just smells bad, than with time in takes on a full finished tobacco smell that smells good.
Color cure I can't comment I have not Color Cured.

 

[springheal]

I feel that the size of the block is important as Bob appears to be doing smallish blocks and the larger the block, maybe a different outcome and being more difficult to control.

What worries me is starting at low temperatures (under 120f) with the risk of mold occurring which may not be seen using the block method.

Will the end result taste better/worse with a higher temperature and being darker?

Very interesting topic.

 

[springheal]

I made a 7 1/2" x 12" x 1 1/2" brick which weighed in at 4 1/2 pounds. Wrapped in a pillow case and strapped with fishing line.
I think I can get 3 such bricks in my little unit . Oh yeah I de-ribbed them also. This would be almost 1/2 my years needs for ciggerettes. Will post results soon . Machine is set for 124 deg F and moisture is not adjusted yet but have unit in mail for that . Will run at 75%??????

How did it go?

Keen to know outcome.