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Which Injector?

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IanA2

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Ha anyone had problems with Powermatic I manual injector? I ordered one in July and it arrived in these sunny shores in August. All was well for a couple of weeks and then it went all clunky on me and doesn't stuff properly.

Powermatic folks think it's a stripped gear, and it makes me wonder if the supplier (off eBay) was selling "seconds". I say this because I have used it entirely as Powermatic instruct, and given that most folks seem to consider it solid, I'm wondering if I was sold a duff.

Great machine when it works.
 

DonH

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Ha anyone had problems with Powermatic I manual injector? I ordered one in July and it arrived in these sunny shores in August. All was well for a couple of weeks and then it went all clunky on me and doesn't stuff properly.

Powermatic folks think it's a stripped gear, and it makes me wonder if the supplier (off eBay) was selling "seconds". I say this because I have used it entirely as Powermatic instruct, and given that most folks seem to consider it solid, I'm wondering if I was sold a duff.

Great machine when it works.
I haven't had any problems with mine. I got it off WLT.
 

FmGrowit

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We've been using the same PM1 for a couple of years in the shop. I have a part time guy who does nothing but create blends (still trying to figure out Balkan Sobranie cigarettes). We test all kinds of new tobaccos when they are made available (working on threshed blends). Needless to say, the stuffer gets used a lot.

The trick is to not over-pack the trough and to be sure the tobacco is not too moist. It's probably not worth sending the injector to Powermatic to fix since the postage would be more than the cost of a new stuffer, but if you can figure out what replacement part you need, they will likely send it to you.
 

IanA2

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Yes, I was careful about making sure the tobacco wasn't too moist, and that it wasn't over-stuffed. Also, I never forced it.

Agree on carriage costs, PM have pretty much said that if it's a particular gear there's a fix and I'm guessing that means they'll send me it, but they have no schematic (or will not release it) but if it's the gear attached to the chassis then, "..they normally recommend buying a new machine." Hmph! Funny kind of warranty!

I'm waiting to hear from PM if the seller I bought it from was selling kosher kit, or if it was an unauthorised "second". That will help clarify things.
 

Knucklehead

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Take the rubber feet off the bottom, remove the 4 screws + 1. There is a metric allen head screw atop one of the main gears. Loosen the screw, hold the gear while operating the handle. When it feels like it's in the right place, tighten the screw. You may have to play with it to get it adjusted just right. It's possible the screw came loose and the gears slipped, rather than stripped. You'll be able to tell which gear needs to be loosened by watching the operation from the bottom. It's the gear that all gears and levers work off of.
 

IanA2

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Take the rubber feet off the bottom, remove the 4 screws + 1. There is a metric allen head screw atop one of the main gears. Loosen the screw, hold the gear while operating the handle. When it feels like it's in the right place, tighten the screw. You may have to play with it to get it adjusted just right. It's possible the screw came loose and the gears slipped, rather than stripped. You'll be able to tell which gear needs to be loosened by watching the operation from the bottom. It's the gear that all gears and levers work off of.

Thanks, that's pretty much what PM told me, although they also said that if it was the main gear attached to the chassis then it was always a return to manufacture job.

I'm waiting to see if it was a second or not before I get out my screwdriver.
 

Knucklehead

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Thanks, that's pretty much what PM told me, although they also said that if it was the main gear attached to the chassis then it was always a return to manufacture job.

I'm waiting to see if it was a second or not before I get out my screwdriver.

If it is still under warranty, send it back to the manufacturer. My Powermatic I manual was out of warranty when I repaired it myself. The gear in question just sits on top of a shaft and is only held in place by the tension of the one metric allen screw. (a standard allen head will strip the screw) Although the screw was very tight, the gear still slipped beneath it. It acted as though something had strippped as the handle quit doing anything. Nothing moved with the handle motion. During adjustment, you may find that the handle will only partially move the innards. Keep adjusting and tightening screw until the handle comes to rest just above the rubber bumper at the end of the pull stroke and the spoon is fully extended into where the tube would be. After adjustment, tighten the screw as tight a possible without stripping.
 

IanA2

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If it is still under warranty, send it back to the manufacturer.

Problem is I'm in the UK. P&P to US & return will be prohibitive plus our customs people will probably want another bite!! As I say, I'm waiting to see if it's a kosher machine I have, if not then I have another route to explore before getting my screwdriver out which I'm hesitating to do as it's still working after a fashion and knowing me it'll not be after it meets my screwdriver!
 

Bex

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After reading all of this (and wanting a manual injector) I'm putting my 2c in for the EXP1000 injector I've been using for a few years. Same basic idea as the Powermatic, except no fancy handle, so no fancy gears. The back pries right off, so no searching for your allen wrench, etc. Simple and reliable. Kinda like me...:)
 

IanA2

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Well I've not really had a great deal of help from Zico, they didn't really answer my last email and I'm not one for banging my head against a wall.

What I have done is read the Amazon reviews. Boy do I wish I had read them before I part with my money.

The pattern revealed by the reviews seems to show that their is considerable variation in people's experiences. It seems that if you are lucky, you get a well built machine that works well.

However, many people seem to have had exactly the same problem that I have experienced. It works fine for a short time, and then it doesn't.

The number of folks experiencing these defects is rather large which makes me think that they have a quality problem either in the specs or construction. Not sure if it's one or other or both, but there does seem to be enough reports to evidence a significant problem.

Have to say I'm a bit miffed. Are Zico a big mob or a garage outfit, anybody know?
 

DGBAMA

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Well I've not really had a great deal of help from Zico, they didn't really answer my last email and I'm not one for banging my head against a wall.

What I have done is read the Amazon reviews. Boy do I wish I had read them before I part with my money.

The pattern revealed by the reviews seems to show that their is considerable variation in people's experiences. It seems that if you are lucky, you get a well built machine that works well.

However, many people seem to have had exactly the same problem that I have experienced. It works fine for a short time, and then it doesn't.

The number of folks experiencing these defects is rather large which makes me think that they have a quality problem either in the specs or construction. Not sure if it's one or other or both, but there does seem to be enough reports to evidence a significant problem.

Have to say I'm a bit miffed. Are Zico a big mob or a garage outfit, anybody know?

Can't speak for the one you bought, manual. But I have the electric version almost two years, and probably 150+ cartons rolled with no problems.

Remember, people who have a negative experience are 100x more likely to write a review than satisfied people, so reviews are often skewed. Badly. Knowing how injectors work, I would bet most of the failures stem from overloading or too most tobacco, or simply forcing the machine. If something feels funny, stop, don't try to make it finish just because you have a great big handle and LOTS of leverage, it will break every time. The injection process is really almost effortless when the baccy is right case and not overloaded.
 

IanA2

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That's pretty much the approach a lot of people have taken. The response to which has been, like me, to say categorically that they have in no way abused the machine. I read up carefully (although not the Amazon reviews) and used the machine exactly in accordance with the manufacturers instructions.

What is interesting is the comments people have made regarding the quality of the steel used in the internals. I'm afraid there are too many people experiencing too many problems to put it down to "user error". Many of these people are experienced "stuffers" and have used other machines before coming to Powermatic.

My feeling is that Zico do not have robust enough QC controls/procedures. I'm guessing they are a big outfit who just give the spec to someone like Alibaba and let them get on with it and prefer to swallow a few returns rather than have expensive but effective QC's.
 

Bex

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Perhaps I'm not supposed to do this....but this is what I have. It's really impossible to roll a cigarette with too much tobacco, too moist, etc., with this, as you are not using a lever, but you're own 'strength' to move the slider across. If it's overloaded, it won't move.
http://www.roll-ups.co.uk/shop/tubi...exp1000-cigarette-maker-cigarette-519182.html

When I was looking for injectors, I was also looking at electric ones, however I read that all the electric ones inject on an auger system, which, in essence, chops up the shred that you have so carefully done - I wanted to keep my shredding intact, so I went with a manual. You can read reviews on this little machine on Amazon, as well. I 'studied' for a long time before I ended up choosing this one....
 

IanA2

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Perhaps I'm not supposed to do this....but this is what I have. It's really impossible to roll a cigarette with too much tobacco, too moist, etc., with this, as you are not using a lever, but you're own 'strength' to move the slider across. If it's overloaded, it won't move.
http://www.roll-ups.co.uk/shop/tubi...exp1000-cigarette-maker-cigarette-519182.html

When I was looking for injectors, I was also looking at electric ones, however I read that all the electric ones inject on an auger system, which, in essence, chops up the shred that you have so carefully done - I wanted to keep my shredding intact, so I went with a manual. You can read reviews on this little machine on Amazon, as well. I 'studied' for a long time before I ended up choosing this one....

I'm looking at that one and also the PM Mini, although with my experience of PM so far maybe I should not. I'm really disappointed with Zico/PM. I paid a lot of money for a lemon. If it had been well made it would be perfect, for when it works it's great.
 

Bex

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While Amazon UK is currently out of the EXP1000, you can still read the reviews that have been posted of it. Personally, while it took a bit of time for me to get the hang of how much tobacco to load, etc., I have now been using my original EXP for at least 2 years, if not more. I even bought a second one, as a backup, in the event that my original one wore out or broke - it's been sitting in its little box, brand new and never used, as the original one just doesn't give up. I have never had a problem with it - it is simple and reliable, IMHO. Certainly, for £12 - less than the cost of 2 packs of fags, it is worth the 'investment', even if you end up buying and preferring something else.
 

IanA2

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Well I've given up on my Powermatic, it's gone from bad but usable to unusable. I'm trying to get them to fix it but I'm not holding my breath. :(
 

IanA2

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While figure out what's wrong/how to fix my Powermatic, I've bought a Mikromatic. Whilst it's not as beautiful as the PM, it's definitely more robust. All internals are metal and because of the lever angle there's no necessity for ninety degree gear interfaces.

Much as I prefer the lever direction on the PM, and it's definitely better looking, I do wonder if it's a question of form before function.

A lesson I have learned is that it is unwise, if you are based in the UK, to buy something that might go phut, from the US. I had foolishly though they might pay inward and outward shipping and fix it for me. Not a chance. Had it been in the EU they would have had to. Oh well you live and learn. Another expensive mistake.
 

bonehead

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i have 2 powermatics. the first one rolled around 115 lbs+++. it got weak and i got another. i took the bottom off the original , cleaned and lubed it, now i have two. shit happens. the worst thing you can do is have your baccy in to high of case. if it groans on the way in and out ( or up and down) you are asking for trouble. your baccy stuffer is ?
 

chillardbee

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attachment.php


Just ordered this little machine to expediate the rolling proccess.
 

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