New Tobacco Grower with lots of questions

[Gibson's Farm]

Hello Every one. I run a small scale sustainable farm. I have a 4 acre produce field and 20 acres of crop ground plus another 40 acres of pasture. I have never grown baccy before but seeing as how I dip 2 cans a day, have the land and equipment I might as well start growing my own and cut out the tax crazy feds and chemical pushing tobacco companies. Now for the questions.

First off I am a dipper so I am looking for a good strain for dip. I was thinking of a dark air cured strain but have not decided on a particular strain. I live in Plant Hardiness Zone 6A. I do not have a means to irrigate the tobacco that I will grow so I need a variety that is also some what drought tolerant. Any suggestions would be appreciated. I plan on planting between 600-1200 plants.

Next question. It seems most of the info in regards to curing baccy is more for curing to smoke. I wont be smoking it, my brother and dad smoke pipe tobacco or camel non filters when we are drinking so it may get smoked some but that will be their problem not mine if it has an ammonia taste. I have a 6000 bushel grain silo that I never use because the other 2 that I have holds all the grain that I grow. So I am considering using the spare silo to cure my baccy. It has fans in the floor so I think that it will make a great place to hang and age my baccy, I imagine it would hold all the baccy I could chew in a life time but id rather have to much than not enough. Does anyone have any insight into using the silo for an air cure barn? In july-august we generally have prolong periods of 90-110 degree days so I would like to have my baccy put in the silo by this time so that it can sweat naturally without the use of a kiln but I don't know if my timing would work out.

Last question. If there is any baccy growers in my Neck of the woods haller at me I live in the North east corner of Oklahoma near grand lake o the Cherokees. Ill grow more tobacco that you can shake a stick at if someone wants to help me. I have cultivating tractors and the hole works, I could just use a hand harvesting, topping and probably using tobacco hahaha.


Thanks in advance for any info and I am sure I will have more questions as time goes by.

 

[FmGrowit]

Welcome to the forum. There are plenty of members who make their own snuff/snus/dip who can offer the details on what tobacco to use. It's my understanding that most dipping tobacco uses Fire Cured tobacco, so you might want to look into that category also.

 

[POGreen]

Very Welcome to the forum !
Use snus myself , perhaps something similar to dip or like that..........

 

[Gibson's Farm]

I have read mixed reviews on fire curing. Some people use it some people use liquid smoke in their dip mixture. I can make a fire in my silo so fire curing isn't out of the question but I think this year I want to keep it simple being that it is my first season. I am a farmer so I am not worried about the growing aspect so much as I am worried about the curing process. I would hate to grow a silo of tobacco and ruin the whole batch trying to fire cure it. Thank you for your reply and I will keep it in mind.

 

[Gibson's Farm]

Very Welcome to the forum !
Use snus myself , perhaps something similar to dip or like that..........

I use grizzly winter green cause its the cheapest thing I can stand to dip but I am not picky. Ill just be happy to save some money and still get my fix

 

[deluxestogie]

Welcome to the forum. Unless your physician has said you have less than a year to live, I would start off with a much smaller grow--600 or 300 or so. You'll have little trouble doing the growing, but there is a definite learning curve on harvesting, color-curing, finishing and storing. The smaller grow will certainly meet your use requirements for a year, and will provide you with less stress over getting everything right on the first try. [If you've only got a year, then go big.]

I suspect that with your high silo temps, your challenge will be maintaining sufficient humidity during color-cure, and again during subsequent aging.

Be sure to read the growers' FAQ (link at the top of each page). Also, check out the index of key forum threads: http://fairtradetobacco.com/threads/3868-Key-threads-in-the-FTT-forum.

Bob

 

[Gibson's Farm]

Welcome to the forum. Unless your physician has said you have less than a year to live, I would start off with a much smaller grow--600 or 300 or so. You'll have little trouble doing the growing, but there is a definite learning curve on harvesting, color-curing, finishing and storing. The smaller grow will certainly meet your use requirements for a year, and will provide you with less stress over getting everything right on the first try. [If you've only got a year, then go big.]

I suspect that with your high silo temps, your challenge will be maintaining sufficient humidity during color-cure, and again during subsequent aging.

Be sure to read the growers' FAQ (link at the top of each page). Also, check out the index of key forum threads: http://fairtradetobacco.com/threads/3868-Key-threads-in-the-FTT-forum.

Bob

Thank you for the info in regards to yield. I based my numbers for the amount of plants based on, one plant yielding 2 ounces of dip, plus loss do to weather or clipping plants with the tractor during cultivating. I know doubt know that there will be a learning curve for harvesting curing and storing finished tobacco. That's why I am asking questions now 3.5 months before I start my seeds. I have read almost all the stickys in the forum in regards to growin, harvesting, curing and that sort of thing. I am for sure worried that im gonna ruin a lot of tobacco but if I can get enough nicotine in my system to keep from buying tobacco I will be ecstatic.

I also agree about humidity being an issue. I think that I can make a water bath inside the silo to help increase humidity. I can open doors or lids in combination with running the floor fans to adjust conditions as needed but it will not be very accurate or easy to maintain.

As for the doctor giving me one year to live.... I am a U.S. Marine veteran, I live every day like its gonna be the last....

 

[Jitterbugdude]

Welcome!.. I grow mostly for dip and pipe tobacco. It is always difficult to answer the "what is best" question. Everyone has different tastes and if you have been dipping Grizzly, then that is what you are used to and may not like homegrown. With that said, you might want to grow a few different varieties for dip such as Big Gem, any Burley, Monte Calme Brun. The variety doesn't seem to matter much to me because of the flavorings that are added. I recently made up a big batch using air cured Virginia Brightleaf. The determining factor might be how much nicotine you want. You will probably find that after tweaking your dip recipe you will throw away any commercial stuff you still have.

As for pipe tobacco you could grow some flavorful Turkish such as Samsun Maden, Bucak, Bursa etc. Add this to some Flue Cured Tobacco and you will have a very tasty smoke.

BTW, an average tobacco plant should give you about 4 ounces of usable tobacco. With dip you add considerable water to the mix so that 4 ounces of tobacco will yield 6 ounces of dip.

 

[AmaxB]

Wow I like you already you are to the point and know what you want to get done. I don't Dip never have I'm a cig man and love my smokes so I don't know how much help I could be. I can say you have found a good forum to get answers.
Welcome!

 

[POGreen]

I use grizzly winter green cause its the cheapest thing I can stand to dip but I am not picky. Ill just be happy to save some money and still get my fix

I think you're gonna be just fine making yer own dip or snus , stalkcured my plants under a bunch of trees late this summer/fall and came out fine after some 6 weeks in August.
August over here was very wet indeed , it must have rained 20-25 days of that month......

 

[Knucklehead]

The owner of this forum (FmGrowit) owns www.wholeleaftobacco.com. Why not start with a lb. of dark air and make yourself some dip? If you don't like that, get a lb. of the fire cured, or burley, or whatever. You may even want to grow a couple of different varieties and make your dip from a blend. Buying whole leaf to start with will help you decide which class or variety you like most for your dip, with minimum investment, and you'll gain some experience handling cured leaf and know ahead of time what equipment you will need to shred, grind, etc. to turn your whole leaf into a dip type consistence. You can also play around with some casings. Don's leaf is the best available on the net.

Plug your zip code in here: http://fairtradetobacco.com/threads/781-Last-and-First-Frost-Date-When-Is-It-Really
It will give you your average first and last frost dates. Start your seed inside six to eight weeks ahead of your last average frost date. I personally shoot for eight weeks due to stronger seedlings and two weeks more leeway to allow for weather variations from year to year.

Even though curing for dip, the goals are the same as curing for smoking. You want to go from green to yellow to brown without the leaf molding or drying so fast that it dries green before it can go through the yellowing and browning stages. Tobacco that has dried green will never taste like tobacco. It does make pretty good mulch though I hate to work that hard for mulch.

 

[deluxestogie]

I am a U.S. Marine veteran, I live every day like its gonna be the last....

A good point. For me, it was the 58[sup]th[/sup] Tac Fighter Squadron, back in the Dark Ages.

Bob

 

[Jitterbugdude]

Bob, They had jets back in WW1?....

 

[Gibson's Farm]

Welcome!.. I grow mostly for dip and pipe tobacco. It is always difficult to answer the "what is best" question. Everyone has different tastes and if you have been dipping Grizzly, then that is what you are used to and may not like homegrown. With that said, you might want to grow a few different varieties for dip such as Big Gem, any Burley, Monte Calme Brun. The variety doesn't seem to matter much to me because of the flavorings that are added. I recently made up a big batch using air cured Virginia Brightleaf. The determining factor might be how much nicotine you want. You will probably find that after tweaking your dip recipe you will throw away any commercial stuff you still have.

As for pipe tobacco you could grow some flavorful Turkish such as Samsun Maden, Bucak, Bursa etc. Add this to some Flue Cured Tobacco and you will have a very tasty smoke.

BTW, an average tobacco plant should give you about 4 ounces of usable tobacco. With dip you add considerable water to the mix so that 4 ounces of tobacco will yield 6 ounces of dip.

I want my nicotine strong! I will grow multiple varieties. I wasn't so much asking for personal opinions on what strain taste best. But more of what strain will grow best in my area. I also used the 2 once reference for a learning curve if I get 6 onces then id have 3 years worth of dip.

As for taste, in Iraq by the time dip go to our base it was dry as sand and taste horrible, still had nicotine though. Right now I will just be happy not paying for dip. Everything taste more sweet when you do it yourself. Plus I think I will save around $2500 a year by not buying dip.

 

[Gibson's Farm]

Plug your zip code in here: http://fairtradetobacco.com/threads/781-Last-and-First-Frost-Date-When-Is-It-Really
It will give you your average first and last frost dates. Start your seed inside six to eight weeks ahead of your last average frost date. I personally shoot for eight weeks due to stronger seedlings and two weeks more leeway to allow for weather variations from year to year.

I am a farmer last years last frost occurred 2 weeks after the average last day of frost according to my records. I plan to set my seeds in the green house march 1-10th depending on how the weather is looking and have them in the ground by may 1st at the latest.

I will try my best not to flash dry it. I guess what I meant was more a long the lines of aging and not curing. Still learning all the tobacco vocabulary.

 

[MarcL]

Welcome to Fair Trade Tobacco.​

 

[Knucklehead]

I will try my best not to flash dry it. I guess what I meant was more a long the lines of aging and not curing. Still learning all the tobacco vocabulary.

It needs to age about a year naturally to get rid of the grassy smell and taste, and the just rawness of the tobacco. OR, you can build a kiln (there is a thread on kilns) and speed age the leaf in the kiln for about a month.

 

[Gibson's Farm]

It needs to age about a year naturally to get rid of the grassy smell and taste, and the just rawness of the tobacco. OR, you can build a kiln (there is a thread on kilns) and speed age the leaf in the kiln for about a month.

I have a 250,000 btu heater that I think I can run in my silo, in combination with my fans, and water bath that I can turn my silo into a kiln. I am pretty sure it will work. It wont be all precise and what not like a commercial kiln but I think it will work good enough for me. No way to know for sure with out trying. You got to break a few eggs to make an amulet.

 

[DrBob]

I have a 250,000 btu heater that I think I can run in my silo, in combination with my fans, and water bath that I can turn my silo into a kiln. I am pretty sure it will work. It wont be all precise and what not like a commercial kiln but I think it will work good enough for me. No way to know for sure with out trying. You got to break a few eggs to make an amulet.

break a few eggs? sounds like you might smash whole henhouse.

that' funny right there 200 plants well tended will give you a lot of good tobacco

 

[Gibson's Farm]

break a few eggs? sounds like you might smash whole henhouse.

I might or I might succeed and save a lot of money and learn a lot in the process. either way I am going to grow tobacco and I am going to grow way more than I need or can handle. If I was afraid of work, the weather, uncertainty, pest, weeds, curing, aging, living, and dying, I might as well just set on my nuts and wait for the government to take care of me... Nah, I am going to go ahead work my ass off, for little to no money and remain a free man.