Professor Pangloss' grow blog

[ProfessorPangloss]

How much would you worry about the neighbor kids getting "green tobacco" sickness - aka nicotine overdose? That row is adjacent to their driveway, and they usually don't play there, but I'd sure hate to be responsible for that. I hear it feels awful.

Obviously I can ask them not to touch, but they'll need to retrieve lost balls and so on.

 

[deluxestogie]

The greatest risk is from working for an extended period among green tobacco that is dew covered. Handling green tobacco for hours can also result in enough nicotine exposure to cause some symptoms. It's unlikely that kids (or adults) would spend much time in contact with icky tobacco leaves, unless they were being paid to do so.

Bob

 

[Michibacy]

+1 to what Bob said.

I've got a rather high nicotine tolerance, but last year I hired my (at the time not pregnant) wife, mother and step dad to help harvest. after an hour, I was still out there (didn't have any cigarettes, cigars or chew in) and I was feeling a nice buzz. The helpers on the other hand were in the house with spinning heads and a very strong buzz.

I've learned since then, either wear gloves/long sleeves or do it a bit earlier in the day cheers

 

[ProfessorPangloss]

Another shot of the garden from the upstairs. Note the baby barn on the left and the totally cardboarded/wood chipped section on right. I still have plenty of mulch left, so I guess I'll have to dig some more beds. No such thing as too many veggies/flowers/smokables.

 

[Knucklehead]

The basketball goal gives perspective to the plot. It's much larger than I had first thought. Is that for a nerf ball?

 

[ProfessorPangloss]

Yep - Nerf goal for the little boy. Of course, that plot is mostly the veggie garden. The Perique goes in the spot next to the shed where it makes an L. Each section of fence is 8', and the plot is about 16' wide. Thing is, after I took inventory of all the good food I would like to eat, I could use a space double that size. Anything worth doing is worth overdoing. That's a motto of mine, and I think plenty of others on this forum, from the looks of it.

 

[ProfessorPangloss]

Here's a couple pictures of my starter greenhouse, about a month out. The weather should be good from here on, so I'm almost ready to plant outside (at least my veggies), but these are very wimpy plants, so I need some advice.

1. The stems seem weak and leggy. This is probably due to not getting enough bright, hot, direct light. I've been trying to set them in the sun as available, but it's kind of haphazard. I don't want them to be too weak to plant and fall over, so I have to do something. I just remembered a gooseneck desk lamp we have somewhere. Should I try that? Next year I will have a more complete light/float rig in the basement, when I finish wiring it up.

2. I have 3" peat pots for transplant, but at this point, would I be better off trying to toughen these guys up and just plant the plugs directly? They obviously have room to grow in these.

3. Though these plugs are pre-fertilized, I wonder if they're hungry. Is this a good time for diluted fish emulsion?

4. I just thinned down to one seedling per plug.

5. In so doing, I noticed that the roots are not very large.

i appreciate any help you all can give!

Edit: the iPad takes truly gruesome photos. Grainy as a beach.

 

[Knucklehead]

I gave my seedlings their first haircut at one month old. The large leaves were 2.5 - 3" long. I began supplemental feeding of water soluble, urea free 20-10-20 Orchid fertilizer one week after germination. There is really very little fertilizer in the soil and the seedlings use it up pretty fast, especially before thinning to one per cell. I don't know how compacted the soil in the jiffy pellets is, but tobacco seedlings like loose soil. I use 2' undercabinet fluorescent light fixtures and the regular bulbs that come in them, they are prewired with a standard male plug. I have four evenly spaced across two 1020 trays, two evenly spaced across one 1020 tray. I don't know what you are using for lighting, but if they are leggy, they need more light.
My guess is that the soil has run out of fertilizer and you should start supplemental feeding right away. Increase light somehow. When the seedlings are larger you will begin to trim the leaves to provide room for the seedlings. This also triggers a defense mechanism and the stems will become thicker. Give them a dose of Epsom salts (magnesium sulfate) one tablespoon per gallon of water. Magnesium sulfate helps with the uptake of nutrients. After that, start the fertilizer.
What is the temperature where the plants are located. I use heated propagation mats under mine. My basement stays around 66F. The mats raise soil temperature around the roots 10-20F over ambient temp.

Urea free 20-10-20: http://www.tindaraorchidsupplies.co...ore-Urea-Free-Orchid-Fertilizer-20-10-20.html
Urea can kill tobacco seedlings.

Best prices for propagation mats, 1020 trays and inserts: http://www.greenhousemegastore.com/
Their flat rate shipping makes a big difference in total cost.

My preferred Seed Starting Mix: http://www.lowes.com/pd_156696-446-...1&currentURL=?Ntt=miracle+gro+soil&facetInfo=
Miracle Gro Potting Soil is terrible for starting seed. It is full of twigs, bark, woody fibrous materials. I love their Seed Starting mix. It is very much like the seed starting mix I got from Bigbonner, a commercial tobacco farmer. Some members like Baccto brand.

I gave $8.00 each for the 2' light fixtures three years ago. They have gone up in price since. The 2' under cabinet lights are extremely easy to store and they come prewired with a standard male plug. My set up is in my grow blog.

It sounds like you want to plant right away. I recommend waiting. Let them get some size to them. I start my seed inside 8 weeks before my projected planting date.

 

[deluxestogie]

The seedlings appear to be at least 1 month away from a transplantable size. You can transplant them earlier, but the slugs and cutworms will be doing high-fives.

In the past, I noticed that the plastic mesh that surrounds peat pellets does not noticeably degrade, and prevents adequate root expansion. When you do transplant them, I would at least split the mesh entirely, down one side. There are likely to be tiny roots passing through the mesh, preventing you from removing it entirely.

Leggy transplants just get planted a bit deeper.

Bob

 

[ProfessorPangloss]

Ok, so diluted fish fertilizer right now, and maybe partial sunlight outside to bulk them up? Then I can use a lamp for now and I'll copy your badass light setup for next year? I skimmed the label of the fish fertilizer (from Lowe's) and I didn't see any urea content, but I'll dilute it just to be safe.

i just got home, having left them out in the sun w/ the dome on. A couple fell right over, but I can re-plant them carefully and a little deeper.

is that an accurate understanding of what should save them?

 

[Knucklehead]

Ok, so diluted fish fertilizer right now, and maybe partial sunlight outside to bulk them up? Then I can use a lamp for now and I'll copy your badass light setup for next year? I skimmed the label of the fish fertilizer (from Lowe's) and I didn't see any urea content, but I'll dilute it just to be safe.

i just got home, having left them out in the sun w/ the dome on. A couple fell right over, but I can re-plant them carefully and a little deeper.

is that an accurate understanding of what should save them?

I would be extremely careful in exposing the little seedlings to direct sunlight right now. Even at 6-8 weeks old the seedlings have to be gradually introduced to full sun. This year, I experienced sunburn on my 6 week old seedlings at only one hour of direct sunlight their first time out. At that time, the large leaves were at least 6". Indirect sunlight is fine.

More light and the addition of nutrients will perk them up nicely. If you can give them a dose of Epsom Salts, one tablespoon per gallon of water, you will see results in three days or less.

I wouldn't really call my light set up badass, but it does have it's advantages for me over larger or more expensive set ups. There are members with some more pricey, but true grow lights that may do a better job (but can everyone afford enough of them for even coverage?). I like the 2' length as the lights and stands can be stored very easily in about the same amount of space as a stack of 1020 trays and inserts. The prewired plugs mean no wiring necessary, plug and play. The price was cheap compared to grow lights and they provide sufficient amounts of whatever spectrum the plants need to live and thrive. The low price and single bulb fixtures allowed me to purchase enough lights to spread them out evenly above my trays, meaning all seedlings receive about the same amount of light. No large seedlings in the middle of the trays with small seedlings along the sides due to lack of light. I might be temped to skimp on more expensive light set ups, causing me to purchase an insufficient number of the lights, which would defeat most of the advantages of those systems. My stems were about the size of a pencil at 8 weeks old and that's pretty darn good. My system works well for Me. Use what works best for you, but put some thought into it. Advantages of my system for me: easy storage in minimal space, easy and fast set up and take down, easy to move from storage to set up area and back (all light fixtures and wiring fit in a box that can be carried full width through door openings), cheap enough to purchase a sufficient number of lights for even and intense light coverage, cheap replacement bulbs, cheap expansion later if needed, and sufficient quality to produce killer transplants in eight weeks. Last year, I had three of the 2' single bulb light fixtures spread evenly over two 1020 trays, this year I went to four lights and could tell a difference in the eveness and intensity of coverage and ended up with better seedlings (same soil, fertilizer, heat mats, location). I might not have even been tempted to add the additional light if the price wasn't right. Check back to this post shortly, I'll post a picture of my light set up in storage.

 

[DGBAMA]

Careful of in the sun with the dome on, it is like a magnifying glass, can get hot enough to cook them to death.

 

[Knucklehead]

In storage:
My entire seed starting set up with the exception of soil. The section of shelving is two feet deep, three feet wide, one foot tall. On the left are my light stands nestled together. The lights set on top of them. One U shape in the middle, two L shaped on the ends, 24" long made from 1x6" boards. (1020 trays measure 10"x20") Three heat mats underneath the stuff, two double wide for two trays, one single wide for one tray. There are eight 2' single bulb undercabinet light fixtures, removable wires with plugs, six spare bulbs, one timer in the box, measuring 8x8x28". One 25' extension cord with three female plug outlets, Two - 8' six plug strips for lights, fertilizer, and misc. between the box and the 1020 trays. On the right is my stack of 1020 trays with three different sets of inserts (one stack of 48 cell inserts, one stack of 72 cell inserts divided into 6 cell sections, one stack of 72 cell inserts divided into 4 cell sections. (Used to fit different needs, seed grow outs or leaf production) If you have the space, storage may not be an issue.



My set up in use on a 6' folding table:
I can fit four 1020 trays there. I can vary number of plants by using 48 cell or 72 cell inserts.
In the photo are two 48 cell inserts for leaf production, and one 72 cell insert used for seed grow out varieties.



One month old seedlings:



Light plug strips and wiring out of the way in the U shaped center stand. Lights are on a timer. Heat mats stay on 24/7:



EDIT: I may add that this set up provided sufficient light that most bud heads were only about 2" above the soil at eight weeks old. Not at all leggy. Some cigar varieties were just leggy growing, bud head about 4" about soil. Stems about the size of a pencil and leaves up to 8" long. I kept giving them haircuts until 6 weeks old and they continuously kept growing huge leaves. The last two weeks I let the leaf grow to take in good sunlight after transplant to the patch.

 

[ProfessorPangloss]

Well. I fed the Epsom salts, then the fish emulsion a day apart, increased the light, and when I got home this evening it appeared that almost 1/2 of my seedlings damped off. I looked through other posts about this, and will try tomorrow (or consider trying) placing more soil about the stems, and then keep up the light in hopes that they may toughen up. I have my original tray of starts, and they look pretty promising, so I could reinforce the ranks to some extent.

Also, I had a strange conversation with the landlord of the house next door (along whose driveway I intended to plant my 20 Catterton plants). Now that I've cleared and mulched the formerly wild and weedy strip of about 50' along my foundation and the driveway, there is some question regarding to whom it belongs. Of course. Since I cleared it, naturally someone else (the tenant, whose lawn is currently calf-deep) is interested, or they want me to leave it alone, or something. I may be forced to relocate or reduce about 2/3 of my potential leaf crop, since I can't exactly short my family's vegetables, and if it is theirs, and the landlord tells me to sod off, I can't use the spot.

lessons learned: next year, build a Knucklehead-ian light rig, a greenhouse, and find a new place nearby to plant a big patch.

 

[Knucklehead]

When it rains it pours. You should be able to get the survey plat for the disputed property from the courthouse for the cost of making a copy to determine who owns the land beside the driveway. If there are property markers (rebar,etc.), their location will be shown on the plat.

Damping off is caused by a soil born fungus. Sterilize tools, trays, tables, etc. that have been in contact with the damped off seedlings to prevent the spread to healthy seedlings. A tablespoon of 3% Hydrogen Peroxide per quart of water misted on surviving seedlings, trays, soil, etc. can help prevent the spread of damping off.
Use soil that drains well - provide good air circulation with fans, etc. - cool soil contributes to damping off, heat mats help - domes on your trays hold in moisture, prevent air circulation, and can lead to damping off - water from the bottom - use loose soil and prevent soil compaction
More damping off info:
http://www2.ca.uky.edu/agcollege/plantpathology/ext_files/PPFShtml/ppfsagt2.pdf
http://www.stclareseeds.com/gardendisease/damping-off.html
http://pss.uvm.edu/ppp/pubs/gd9.htm
http://www.ipm.ucdavis.edu/PMG/PESTNOTES/pn74132.html

Sorry to hear of your misfortunes. Good luck.

 

[ProfessorPangloss]

Okay, so a few days later, here's where I'm at. I have stopped trying to prop up the damping off seedlings. Consequently, there are about 6 good Periques and about 8 good Cattertons. However, I also have the germination flats with some good looking plants I can probably use. I am going to transplant into 3" peat pots today and chuck the goners, replenishing from my extras. I have fed Epsom salts and fish emulsion, and the seedlings look a little greener, but I think they need more light that I can't give them inside. Also, the cat ate the tips of my tomato seedlings, so I have to try to salvage them with a shot of fertilizer and a transplant outside.

Also, because I am full-scale growing vegetables and flowers right now as well, I have run out of indoor space for trays, and I need everything to get more light anyway. So I built a very shoddy ad-hoc greenhouse with a few pallets, about 7 drywall screws, and a plastic drop cloth. It's on the back of my house (northern exposure), and it gets direct light early in the morning, and then ambient light after that. I'm going to move these transplants out there and hope that they buck up in the shelter of that little hut.

Regarding the other problem, my house is old and there is no official plat map. I feel like I have a vested interest in there being one, so if I commission an official survey, it will be recorded at the courthouse and referenced in my deed. It's only money...

 

[Michibacy]

Yup only money, can't take it with you when you die, but die if you don't have any. Lifesabitch eh?

Nice looking greenhouse-hutch though. That'll come in handy for sure. If you need more light in there, perhaps a more transparent painters drop cloth would help. The opaque one you have might reflect too much light for what you are wanting to do. (besides keep in heat and moisture). From reading I've done, a figure comes to mind about greenhouse plastic. Though this is a broad number, some plastics (depending on plastic variety, thickness, opacity, angle, water droplets on plastic etc) can reflect 20-40% of solar radiation AWAY from the inside of the structure.

That's why a lot of greenhouse are clear glass, or thick polyethylene sheets (WITHOUT substantial UV inhibitors)

 

[ProfessorPangloss]

Yeah, you're definitely right about the plastic, but it's just a cheap Lowe's one I had laying around. Our baby is due today (but has not yet made indication of arriving), so the past few weeks have been a total hurricane of projects - puttering around the house like an old man. I literally found that piece laying in my side yard from where it was covering a pile of scrap drywall I finally got rid of. My life is a shambles.

Also, the weather here has really changed. It's been 80+ for a few days and no rain for a week. Reflecting heat off the seedings is probably what I want at the moment, because I don't want everything else to die all at once. Just my luck, right? It's fine. I would trade all the bad seed karma in the world for one healthy baby/mama combination. Priorities.

 

[Michibacy]

+1 thumbs up Professor!

My life is crazy and hectic as well. Working 10-14 hour days, ontop of house work and farm work has gained me a caffeine addiction and a sleeping pattern much like that of a baby.
you folks are in my prayers, remember, help her with breathing and everything shes says to you during the labor can't be held against her....so I'm told...

 

[ProfessorPangloss]

Man, for what it's worth, I exhausted my supply of filthy and inappropriate jokes during the pushing stage, because it dragged on so long, it was like some kind of in-the-trenches war story. Totally surreal. The nurse and the midwife thought it was funny as hell, and it made for a memorable story.