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Newbie first grow [Vancouver, WA]

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mrthing2000

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I started out with a couple of packets of seeds--Burley and Virginia Gold, and later got some Yellow Orinoco and Lizard Tail. I struggled to get things going at first.

I found that seeds either didn't germinate well, rose too quickly and damped off, or would mold. Turns out I needed to use a humidity dome with lights, and problem solved! The plants grow a bit more robust and look less like alfalfa sprouts. They don't grow 3 inches with a tiny stem and fall over. Right now the second germination attempt looks a lot like little bits of clover. I'll have to thin them soon. I tried a couple in those expanding hockey puck things. They seem happy.

I started 10 in a hydro DWC setup to see how that would work... sort of a float tray thing using the Aerogarden type pods with a peat moss insert to hold the seeds. I'll see if I can get some decent results from this and go from there.

I was hoping to buy some actual seedlings or plants to start, but I think I started way too late to get them. So its all from seed then! I've got about 120 days until the first frost, and I'm building a cold frame if its not all done by then.

My main struggle has been figuring out what nutrients to use. I have a bunch of hydroponic nutrients from my basil and tomato grows. Supposedly they can be used in soil--but in what concentrations and how much, its not clear. And how often. I've managed not to 'burn' the plants yet, but they don't seem super happy either. Not very dark green and probably underfed. I did cut a few of the whimpy leaves off and that seemed to help.

I'm growing most in peat pots, I think the 5" ones. These dry out too quickly in the hot sun. I got some larger pots and will eventually transplant into 5gal ones. A few others will go in the ground.

I really wish I hadn't mixed up the plants that are outside. They could all be Burley, Virginia Gold, or maybe one of the other two. Or they could be a combination of all of those. My newest germination attempt will be a lot more careful, bottom-watering, getting the plants happier before moving outside, and getting the plants labeled before moving them around.

Plan is to try a few things--make a few cigs, make some pipe tobacco, and try my hand at a knockoff Copenhagen or Cherry Skoal. I watched a video on cigar rolling and it doesn't look especially difficult, but I might want to get some whole leaf stuff to even things out. Not a big cigar fan though.

I wish I had done a few dark plants. And some Turkish ones. It might make for better blending. At this point I'll just follow other people's recommendations on those.

Curing will be a tough one for me. I can air dry probably easily, but overdoing it may be a problem. Humidity here is maybe 40-50% most of the time, and it might dry out hard and quickly. I have a shady overhang that may help. I might build a flue eventually. I'm hoping that drying them in the garage isn't a problem. Mine is pretty well insulated but I don't want it to pick up 'off flavors'. Depending on when it is all done, it could be October or November. If I can do it outside I will certainly try.

I'll post some pics soon. Thanks for reading! Any suggestions are helpful
 
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deluxestogie

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Re: Newbie first grow [Vancoouver, WA]

Welcome to the forum.

One approach to color-curing in a low humidity environment is to construct a makeshift tent inside your curing space. You can use sheet plastic or a tarp--anything that can slow evaporation from the green leaves. If you can allow the leaves to develop at least a bit of yellow in the field, before harvesting, they will have a better chance of coloring, rather than drying green.

Bob
 

mrthing2000

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Re: Newbie first grow [Vancoouver, WA]

Thanks so much. I just wondered a quick question--for setting these in plastic cells (the black ones that are maybe 2" wide and 4" deep), how tight do you tamp down the soil? I've heard if it is too tight the roots get mad, but if it is too loose--will it still be able to bottom water?

I noticed today that the flat that I started has a bit of algae growing on it. Probably a result of damp spots and lights on it 24 hours a day for the past 10 days or so. I've been opening the lid for a few hours and leaving it 1" open the rest of the time. I just hit it with a foliar spray of about a 1/2 strength hydroponic solution to see what would happen. I also misted the rest of the plants outside with the same solution. The leaves were getting a bit pale and I've not fertilized them properly--I think. Hopefully I didn't wreck everything.
 

mrthing2000

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Re: Newbie first grow [Vancoouver, WA]

How yellow should they get? Totally dried out? Crunchy? A bit yellow? I see a few leaves yellowing now, but I'm thinking those are just suckers and I've pulled them off. They've been touching the soil and probably a bit heat stressed--its been hot as hell and I brought them outside WAYYYY too early. Didn't know they should be 8" and 8 weeks--I probably brought them outside a 3" high and 3-4 weeks. They only were happy in partial shade--figures. I brought them into the sun today.
 

mrthing2000

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Re: Newbie first grow [Vancoouver, WA]

Sorry I mispelled Vancouver in the thread post. Doh! No way to fix it I guess.
 

Knucklehead

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Re: Newbie first grow [Vancoouver, WA]

Thanks so much. I just wondered a quick question--for setting these in plastic cells (the black ones that are maybe 2" wide and 4" deep), how tight do you tamp down the soil? I've heard if it is too tight the roots get mad, but if it is too loose--will it still be able to bottom water?

Video of one our members, a commercial grower, filling a float tray with soil.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bePf-5W98H4

The ability to wick up water from the bottom tray without drowning the seedlings depends on the soil you are using. A good seed starting soil is recommended. The clear plastic domes are not really necessary, and can actually cause more harm than good.
 

mrthing2000

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Here's one pic. The seedlings are still small but getting larger true leaves. These are the survivors of the first few germination attempts. I made the mistake of leaving them in the full sun all day today, despite having watered them yesterday. Maybe the small pots got too hot (they are black). The leaves were all laying down sadly. I moved them to this spot, gave them a quick drink, within 10 minutes I took this picture.

20150708_165300 (1).jpg
 

mrthing2000

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The things in the background are Indian corn plants and some other stuff. The bag is a bag of lump mesquite charcoal. I like it.

Here's what the seedlings are doing:

20150708_165606.jpg

They are getting bigger leaves and not spindly. Looks like the grow lights are a surefire winner for this.
 

mrthing2000

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Re: Newbie first grow [Vancoouver, WA]

This is a second tray--I tried to do 3 different types of seeds. Yellow Orinoco, Lizard Tail, and either Burley or Virginia Gold. Well, either the other tray is ALL Burley or ALL Virginia Gold, so whatever the other one is, it is this tray. I knew Lizard Tail was the last one but the labels flew off and got mixed up with the other tray.

The skewer was to separate the space between the 2 types. As you can see, the other 2 sprouted ZILCH. I got very few off the first 2 attempts, but did get some (all spindly--my fault) but ZERO off this bunch. I think I may get some Dark Leaf and Turkish seeds and start those to see what I can do. Should be a long growing year here.

I'm ready to put these into 'real' cells now so I can bottom water them. Arguably I should have started them in those.

20150708_165515.jpg
 

mrthing2000

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Re: Newbie first grow [Vancoouver, WA]

I tried a modified float tray using some Aerogarden pods and peat 'pill' things I had laying around. As they started to sprout I dropped the water to just slightly above the bottom of the pill. Up to this point I had it close to the top of the tray. This should give a bottom water effect. The nutrient mix is a diluted mixture of a compost tea, about 1/3 strength. It is not directly under the lights yet, but it is right next to the other ones that are. So far so good. 10 cells, about 5-10 seeds in each (wish I had the pelletized ones).

20150708_165403.jpg
 

mrthing2000

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Re: Newbie first grow [Vancoouver, WA]

Last experiment for this group was to use those peat hockey puck things. I bought a small bag, added some water, and they puff up huge. I added some seeds to it and compared how they handled this method. Seems pretty good--a compromise between hydroponic and soilless mix type. The hole in the pot gives a bit of breathing room so the sprouts can get a stem going before they really start to grow. For some odd reason this one seed is growing out of the SIDE of the pot, so I have it turned sideways to give it a chance. A bunch of the other things in that growing tray are not tobacco seeds. I think there are some sunflower, Indian corn (just beyond the frame) and some random other stuff there.

20150708_165438.jpg
 

mrthing2000

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The seedlings are doing great. I'll let them get much MUCH bigger before trying to move them outside. The plants are probably the size of a quarter now. Only problem I am having is algae forming on the soil. I'm not sure if that is a problem but I'll hit it with a tiny layer of sand and hopefully wipe it out. Not bottom-watering these and applying nutrients to the top, plus the humidity dome, 24 hr lights, and growing them in potting soil is probably contributing.

The outside plants are happier since I started pulling off the bottom leaves and some that get a bit pale. I gulped as I pulled off leaves. Isn't the goal to have leaves? But it really helped. The new ones grew very quickly and are much greener. Now the stem is strong and much bigger. I should have some of the bigger ones in the ground by Tuesday. I'll put up a light shade for the intense sun days until they get fully settled. They have a tendency to wilt easily at this point.

I wish I had bottom-watered all of them and moved them outside when they were much taller. The heat didn't do anything nice to them. Hopefully this second seed generation I've got going will catch up to these--I'm thinking it very well might.
 

mrthing2000

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I tried bottom feeding the black pots in water. Those are hydroponic pots that I've used before for ebb-and-flow systems. It took a really long time to see water percolating upward. I'm thinking the top-watering compacted the soil a bit much. I haven't gotten them in the ground yet but will soon. I hit them with some slow-release fertilizer and foliar fed them today.
 

mrthing2000

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We had a couple of mid-90 degree days and I wasn't going to be home, so I did my watering of the potted plants and gave them a foliar mist and moved them to a spot between the house and the shed. I'd say it is at least partial to mostly shade. Wow--they probably doubled in size in 2 days. Time to get them in the ground.

The 'tray' ones in the picture above got moved to dixie cups. I ended up with about 30 good transplants. Unfortunately I can't tell the Virginia Gold from the Burley ones. One of them had a whole bunch of round leaves, sort of reminding me of a clover. The other has more 'bay leaf' shape to them. That batch was way bigger than the other mystery one. one was about double the size of the others. I gave them all a trimming keeping 3-4 leaves max on them. Just for experimentation I used a soilless mix, topsoil, and some supposed 'garden soil' which is almost straight mulched up barkdust crap. I'd swear they doubled in size in 2 days. I just left them in the water for 2 days (way too long) to see how resilient they would be. Very happy plants. I pulled them out of the water and cut the lights out to give them a rest and start to normalize their day/night cycle to 15/9. Still experimenting.

I figure from the earlier mistakes I've made, these will not only turn out better, but they'll catch up to the others in 2-3 weeks. I should have about 35-45 good plants by then, assuming I lose a couple I may get around 25-30. Given the area I have to play with that will take up enough without overlap with good spacing. I'll stick a few in the spots in the shade and just compare their growth. We should have a long growing season this year, with a first frost in late November, so a late start 'should' be okay. I'll make a coldframe for them if it gets too cold before they finish.

So--I've made all the rookie mistakes but despite that, things look okay. A first attempt anyway.
 
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