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Entubado?

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RSG

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While looking around on the forums I discovered a method of rolling called entubado.. I did some research and I just want to make sure I understand it correctly. Each filler leaf is rolled into a tube, and then pressed together when bound and wrapped which holds them tightly together, but still maintains a good draw, correct?

From experience, does this work well? How tightly do you roll each filler 'tube'?

Thanks a lot guys!
 

Smokin Harley

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While looking around on the forums I discovered a method of rolling called entubado.. I did some research and I just want to make sure I understand it correctly. Each filler leaf is rolled into a tube, and then pressed together when bound and wrapped which holds them tightly together, but still maintains a good draw, correct?

From experience, does this work well? How tightly do you roll each filler 'tube'?

Thanks a lot guys!
Yes, thats pretty much it. I don't really roll my leaves into individual tubes , more like I fold them twice or three times, but loosely. Then as you bind them , as long as they are mostly dry ,bind it as firmly as you can. As long as you don't inadvertantly twist the bunch while applying the binder ,it draws perfectly.
 

MarcL

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This video shows three tubing methods : 2 cigars Entubado, 1 cigar Semi Entubado and 1 cigar Estrujado.

 

RSG

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RSG, how's the Entubado rolling coming along ?

I actually never tried it. It looked pretty complicated since I already had a way to roll which gave me a good draw and burn.

I just lay the leaves on flat stacks with the harder to burn stuff in the middle (ligero in middle, followed by viso, seco on outside). I then cut the ends off and put all of it in the most middle part, but try to lay the bits and pieces flat. Then I roll it up and bind it and it smokes great! It might not be professional, but it always gives a good burn and draw, so I love it.
 

ArizonaDave

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As long as you don't inadvertantly twist the bunch while applying the binder ,it draws perfectly.
That sentence is the key to a good entubado roll. Also the inhale should be slow. There are several threads and videos here on FTT that address a good entubado roll. See Daddy's videos on how to roll.
 

Smokin Harley

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I actually never tried it. It looked pretty complicated since I already had a way to roll which gave me a good draw and burn.

I just lay the leaves on flat stacks with the harder to burn stuff in the middle (ligero in middle, followed by viso, seco on outside). I then cut the ends off and put all of it in the most middle part, but try to lay the bits and pieces flat. Then I roll it up and bind it and it smokes great! It might not be professional, but it always gives a good burn and draw, so I love it.

what you're doing sounds similar to the book method. No need to cut the ends neat. I've watched videos of guys who have like cardboard "pattern" sizes and end up with a lot of scrap . Entubado once you get the idea is easy and wastes very little. Form the individual "tubes" with both hands, hold each one in succession in your off hands ring and pinky finger so they don't unroll while you roll the next ones with the other hand and the remaining 3 fingers . Once you get your blend rolled arrange the tubes so the ligero is in the middle .The seco and viso leaves, I usually have the "legs" of the leaves rolled as separate tubes and I'll alternate those in with the others. You'll have your binder laid out already in front of you before you roll your tubes. Once your hand is full of the tubes and arranged,Take note of the ends sticking out beyond the rest, just rip these off and lay them aside in a scrap pile (I'll get back to what to do with this in a minute) take it to the binder and roll it up in the spiral fashion starting at the foot end. This keeps the layers always under each other and while smoking it will not unravel. If when you come to the head end you have a soft spot ,simply take a piece from your scrap pile and put that in to firm it up. Makes forming the head and capping much easier . Chances are if its within an inch of the head it won't get burned anyway so its just for keeping it firm during the smoke.
 

RSG

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what you're doing sounds similar to the book method. No need to cut the ends neat. I've watched videos of guys who have like cardboard "pattern" sizes and end up with a lot of scrap . Entubado once you get the idea is easy and wastes very little. Form the individual "tubes" with both hands, hold each one in succession in your off hands ring and pinky finger so they don't unroll while you roll the next ones with the other hand and the remaining 3 fingers . Once you get your blend rolled arrange the tubes so the ligero is in the middle .The seco and viso leaves, I usually have the "legs" of the leaves rolled as separate tubes and I'll alternate those in with the others. You'll have your binder laid out already in front of you before you roll your tubes. Once your hand is full of the tubes and arranged,Take note of the ends sticking out beyond the rest, just rip these off and lay them aside in a scrap pile (I'll get back to what to do with this in a minute) take it to the binder and roll it up in the spiral fashion starting at the foot end. This keeps the layers always under each other and while smoking it will not unravel. If when you come to the head end you have a soft spot ,simply take a piece from your scrap pile and put that in to firm it up. Makes forming the head and capping much easier . Chances are if its within an inch of the head it won't get burned anyway so its just for keeping it firm during the smoke.

That doesn't sound too difficult.. maybe I'll give it a try. Do you see any real benefits from rolling this way? I see it's how you roll... Hahaha
 

Smokin Harley

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Its not hard at all. any benefits,hmmm...I like to see how the artisans do their craft. I like to do things traditionally . But it does draw well and burns even, and I almost always get a nice razor sharp burn edge. I've had some high end cigars that I've bought that tasted great but burned terribly or canoed badly. Case in point- Inch by E.P Carillo, always burns up one side and goes out about mid way . Not sure how it is rolled but almost every one of them does it.
watch this lady . I've watched this video dozens of times.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oasO67QTUv0

Another 2 videos I've watched dozens of times is this man(below), Tim Torres ,master torcedor. I've watched them the whole way through a few times and then sat down with my leaf ,stopped and watched parts over and over...make sure you go full screen . He explains the method ,tradition and why things are done the way they are. If I ever make it out to Scottsdale AZ and hes still in business , I'm paying him a visit .One to watch him roll in person and then buy it and the other is to thank him for his video showing his artisan craft. Maybe see if I can get a personal tutoring while I'm at it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9heepl-hAXo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VC7wAFjb1uA

The one thing I would like to improve of my own rolling is the cap. I do a triple cap but the finished product isn't always as smooth as I'd like. Not sure if its the part of the leaf I'm using , or just my technique. Its hard to get a nice close-up video without the rollers fingers being in the way or the speed of which it is executed. I have done good caps , but I'm not as consistent as I'd like.
 

RSG

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Wow. I only had time to watch the first one right now, but that woman can roll a cigar!! She's so fast too.. it takes me a solid 4 hours to roll 8 cigars. Them again she has the wrapper, binders, and filler all prepped and on hand, but that is very impressive. She appears to bunch the fillers loosely, but it looks like it works well.

How many leaves would you use in a cigar that size? I would probably use a good 5-6 filler leaves, but she only uses 3. Makes me think I'm screwing up.. geez. Hahaha
 

Smokin Harley

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In a churchill (I have both 7x48 and 7x50 wooden molds)I normally use 4.5 total... 3 fillers (1 each- ligero,seco and viso )1 binder (both halves) and 1/2 for the wrapper. If one of the filler leaves is super thin I'll use more.
 

RSG

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In a churchill (I have both 7x48 and 7x50 wooden molds)I normally use 4.5 total... 3 fillers (1 each- ligero,seco and viso )1 binder (both halves) and 1/2 for the wrapper. If one of the filler leaves is super thin I'll use more.

My goodness. Does that give you a tightly packed cigar? I roll 7*46 (mold says 48 but it's actually 46) and I need 4.5 fillers and sometimes it still feels a little squishy. Maybe I'm a terrible cigar roller? Hahhaha
 

Smokin Harley

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Its not tight at all. If your filler is in low case -dry ,barely flexible but not so crispy it shatters ... you should be able to roll it fairly tight and still draw very well.
Maybe your leaves are smaller than what I'm using . It like having a piece of cake ...your slices may be 2 inches at the wide end of the wedge and mine are more like 4 inches .
I have a small digital postal scale . What I should do is weigh a sticks worth of filler . From then on the sticks made after if using the same exact amount in the same size mold(my molds are 7" x 48 and 50rg)should all fill similarly and draw should be constant . Right now I go by feel in the hand and while checking for soft spots while binding on the rolling board if I have too much or too little .
I used to put more leaf into my sticks but then after smoking them I realized one more leaf wasn't making the blend any better or worse and it was just a waste of one leaf that could have gone into making one more cigar.
Take note in the members blends thread- there are blend "recipes" that call for 1/4 or 1/2 leaf. Its about proportion . Requirements of x amount of total filler leaf in order to properly fill the slot in the mold. Add more than it can hold and the draw will be tight and you'll stress the mold in the process.
 

RSG

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Its not tight at all. If your filler is in low case -dry ,barely flexible but not so crispy it shatters ... you should be able to roll it fairly tight and still draw very well.
Maybe your leaves are smaller than what I'm using . It like having a piece of cake ...your slices may be 2 inches at the wide end of the wedge and mine are more like 4 inches .
I have a small digital postal scale . What I should do is weigh a sticks worth of filler . From then on the sticks made after if using the same exact amount in the same size mold(my molds are 7" x 48 and 50rg)should all fill similarly and draw should be constant . Right now I go by feel in the hand and while checking for soft spots while binding on the rolling board if I have too much or too little .
I used to put more leaf into my sticks but then after smoking them I realized one more leaf wasn't making the blend any better or worse and it was just a waste of one leaf that could have gone into making one more cigar.
Take note in the members blends thread- there are blend "recipes" that call for 1/4 or 1/2 leaf. Its about proportion . Requirements of x amount of total filler leaf in order to properly fill the slot in the mold. Add more than it can hold and the draw will be tight and you'll stress the mold in the process.

That may be it, some of the leaves I use are small/thin, which would take up less space. It just concerned be to hear other people use a mere three leaves! I enjoy my cigars, but then again I can always learn a thing or two!
 

RSG

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Probably not. It just takes a lot of practice. Going through my packed humidor, I came across the first cigar I ever rolled. I threw it into my scrap pile, but it will not go to waste. Sometimes all you'll need is a rewrap. You'll get a lot better at it.

You didn't smoke your first ever?! That's just wrong..
 
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