• Dear Guest,

    We've been using a forum format called vBulletin for over seven years and the program is no longer being developed, so that means no more updates or security patches. vBulletin has never been compatible with search engine optimization and it does not support the multitude of various devices most people use to access the internet, so it's time to say goodbye to vBulletin.

    For these reasons we have moved our forum to a new format that will support and encourage growth for the next generation of grower and DIY tobacco users.

    So please post any issues you're having with using the new site.

    As usual, you may login with your old password.

Whole Leaf Tobacco

Perique and bubbles

Charly

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 1, 2016
Messages
1,206
Likes
116
Points
63
Location
France
#1
Hi everyone,
this year, I started my first crop of tobacco, and since I like experimentations, I decided to try to make my perique (because i love VaPers in my pipes !).


I'm french, so excuse my english ;)


My first question is about the bubbles one can see escaping from the leaves under pressure : my leaves started to bubble after about one day under pressure, and continued to bubble during about 5 days. Now they are not bubbling anymore. Don't they need to bubble longer ? I thought the perique would keep on bubbling for a long time... how long did your perique bubble ?


I used "cherry red 401" virginia leaves for my perique, since it is the only strain that gave me enough leaves to experiment.
The method I used for my perique is inspired by the one from an old book (http://www.saveseeds.org/library/books/Tobacco_Leaf/tobacco_leaf_1897.html) :
- I used color cured leaves, washed and stemmed
- I put my leaves under pressure in a jar (using the "jar in the jar" method)
- I opened it after 24 hours (it smelled like some light tea), aired the leaves for an hour (separated in a plate), then put them under pressure again (putting enough pressure so that all the leaves are under the liquid).
- I opened it 2 times since, I layed the leaves in a plate (separating them), after 1 hour I put it under pressure again.


The smell of the jar changed during those days : light "tea" the first day, vinagary/leathey after 3 days (not great aroma), then more fruity after 5 days (quite pleasing).


I plan on opening the jar in about one week and see what changes.


I've got a lot of other questions, I'll post them in the right places soon.
Thank you for all the informations available on your forum, this place is heaven for someone willing to smoke his own tobacco !
Charles.
 

Gavroche

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 2, 2016
Messages
1,073
Likes
73
Points
0
Location
Ile de France France
#2
Salut Charles,

j'ai fait comme toi mais parce que trop de tabac et pas assez d’étendage... du coup j'ai aussi mis des feuilles vertes... comment as-tu fait pour la pression ? moi, j'utilise un rond de bois et un cric de voiture... je pense qu'il y a deux sorte de bulles, celles qui viennent des feuilles (air emprisonné) au fur et à mesure du serrage ça monte et ce pendant un jour ou deux) et celles de la fermentation...plus tard.
 

Charly

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 1, 2016
Messages
1,206
Likes
116
Points
63
Location
France
#3
Bonjour Gavroche,


Pour la pression, j'ai écrasé à la main, et j'ai refermé le bocal (avec un bocal à l'intérieur, écrasé par le couvercle).


J'avais également remarqué qu'il y avait 2 types de bulles : celles qui montent lorsqu'on met sous presse (air emprisonné entre les feuilles qui s'échappe) et celles qui sortent lentement alors que la pression est déjà en place (d'ailleurs, lorsque j'ouvre mon pot, j'entend le "psschit" du gaz qui s'échappe).
Je parle de la deuxieme sorte de bulles (celles qui montent doucement plusieurs heures après la mise sous presse).
Est-ce que ton pot fait encore des bulles ?


----


Hi Gavroche,


I have noted, as you say, that there are two kinds of bubbles : the ones that come when you put the pressure, and the ones that come slowly long after the pressure is on.
I am talking about the later ones. The first days, there were bubbles regularly, now there are only bubbles when I put more pressure...
Is it good or not ? is it fermenting or not ?
 

SmokesAhoy

Super Moderator
Founding Member
Joined
May 22, 2011
Messages
2,688
Likes
93
Points
0
Location
VT
#4
The initial bubbles that came on shortly after everything was set might have been yeast acting on the immediately available sugars. It still needs more time though.
 

deluxestogie

Administrator
Joined
May 25, 2011
Messages
12,542
Likes
1,386
Points
113
Location
near Blacksburg, VA
#5
I'm french, so excuse my english
Your English is excellent. (During my visits to France, years ago, nobody forgave my French.)

I usually pressure-cure my Perique for at least 3 months. During the last 2 months of that time, I seldom notice any bubbles.

I wish you the best with your Perique cure. Post some photographs.

Bob
 

Charly

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 1, 2016
Messages
1,206
Likes
116
Points
63
Location
France
#6
The initial bubbles that came on shortly after everything was set might have been yeast acting on the immediately available sugars. It still needs more time though.
So the first bubbles are not really part of the perique curing ?
I already planned on letting it for about three months just like I've read here :)

Your English is excellent. (During my visits to France, years ago, nobody forgave my French.)
Thank you Bob :)
French people are not often kind... in France, when someone smiles, it seems suspect :D French people are often in bad mood... ;) That's what makes me feel like I might not really be French :D :D :D
Hopefully, everyone is not like this ;)

I usually pressure-cure my Perique for at least 3 months. During the last 2 months of that time, I seldom notice any bubbles.

I wish you the best with your Perique cure. Post some photographs.

Bob
So no bubbles is not a bad sign, good ! I'll leave my perique do its job quietly then :)
I'll post some pictures soon.
 

Jitterbugdude

Moderator
Founding Member
Joined
May 22, 2011
Messages
4,068
Likes
283
Points
83
Location
Northeast Maryland
#7
The initial bubbles that came on shortly after everything was set might have been yeast acting on the immediately available sugars. It still needs more time though.
Actually just the opposite. The initial fermentation is due to Lactobacilli bacteria. As they begin to increase in population it drives the pH lower and lower until finally the Lactobacilli die off and are over taken by yeasts.
 

Charly

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 1, 2016
Messages
1,206
Likes
116
Points
63
Location
France
#8
Actually just the opposite. The initial fermentation is due to Lactobacilli bacteria. As they begin to increase in population it drives the pH lower and lower until finally the Lactobacilli die off and are over taken by yeasts.
Thanks for those details, I will watch closely the evolution of my first perique batch :)
 
Joined
Sep 1, 2014
Messages
3,008
Likes
443
Points
83
Location
Edmonton, AB, CA
#9
I am doing a small batch by vacuum sealing excessively moist tobacco. I'm using a mixture of the various lugs from my entire crop. There are two bags going. One was leaf as it was, the other was toasted. Within a day it was clear the first batch was swelling. I opened and resealed the bags today. The first batch brought me back to the aroma of some vacuum sealed sugar cane my parents brought back from Hawaii thirty years ago. Definitely lactic acid, and maybe ethanol in there. The other bag which had toasted tobacco in it, which didn't swell at all smells exactly the same as when it went in. There was even one or two tiny spots of white mold. It was toasted at 285F for half an hour. The acid and ethanol must be protecting the first batch.
 

Jitterbugdude

Moderator
Founding Member
Joined
May 22, 2011
Messages
4,068
Likes
283
Points
83
Location
Northeast Maryland
#10
There have been a few guys on here that in the past used the vacuum method (in a bag). Can't really remember what their final results were like though.
 
Joined
Sep 1, 2014
Messages
3,008
Likes
443
Points
83
Location
Edmonton, AB, CA
#11
There have been a few guys on here that in the past used the vacuum method (in a bag). Can't really remember what their final results were like though.
I did it in 2014. It's chocolaty and doesn't really have the true peppery profile. That could be other factors too, though. It does function to balance hot burning bright varieties.
 
Top