Whole Leaf Tobacco

Grow diary of 2021 first bulk grow

Clatsopnehalem

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How are you fertilizing? You referenced liquid compost and fish fertilizer during the seedling stage. Are you sticking to the non chemical fertilizers?
I am just watering for now because we tilled in 3 bags kelp meal , 4 bags fish meal , 5 bags fish bone meal. But the fish fertilizer brand is Alaskan fish fertilizer not is 5-1-1 and the liquid compost is a small business that stuff is great it has kelp and a bunch of fermented plant juices like horsetail and chamomile and a few others. We are going to just stick to epsom salt for the next “fertilizer/feeding” maybe some chicken manure compost. Yes non chemical fertilizer and I actually chop my tobacco stalks up and turn them into fermented plant juice and use it as an insecticide as well as a fertilizer that I assume is high in nitrogen and potassium based on what I’ve read. When I water with it and spray it on my garden it makes everything go green green green in just a couple days say I was having yellowing and bugs dominating I give a heavy dose like 20ml per gallon of that stuff and no more issue. Unfortunately I have none left cus I have my last years batch away to a friend who was trying to switch to more natural practices So this crop will make a lot more thankfully. I also need to take a soil sample next year because it’s a first year till so we are totally winging it hahaha.
 

Knucklehead

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I planted them out in June 25th maybe 24th cus I remember it took us two days. But nothing noticeable as far as bud sights so no flowering yet no
Some info on your Samsun. The 65-70 days to maturity is just a general idea, but I think your plants are approximately half way there. I do recommend pulling the suckers off. The energy that was going to the inferior leaf will go to the main leaves and increase size and weight of the desirable leaf. The commercial growers do sucker control with chemicals. I do it the manual way. :D

edit: I forgot the link :rolleyes:

 

Clatsopnehalem

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Some info on your Samsun. The 65-70 days to maturity is just a general idea, but I think your plants are approximately half way there. I do recommend pulling the suckers off. The energy that was going to the inferior leaf will go to the main leaves and increase size and weight of the desirable leaf. The commercial growers do sucker control with chemicals. I do it the manual way. :D

edit: I forgot the link :rolleyes:

Ok this is great information I’ll pluck the suckers tomorrow afternoon, do you think if I hung and dried those branches the leaf would be any good? Cus if not I’d rather turn em into fermented plant juice if it’s not worth drying them. Ya I like the manual way also I’ve only ever grown a few plants before now so it didn’t really last long in our household so this is super exciting cus I’m use to buying sampsun leaf not really growing it and these leaves are huge compared to what I baught from Greece a while back. This is why earlier I was questioning weather or not the genetics were true but I bet it has something to do with environmental differences possibly. Otherwise I’ve grown a few Virginia gold plants that were just mammoth like and a kind of burley variety possible burley21 or burley21 cross, and a rustics variety that doesn’t get tall it probably got 3 feet tall maximum on the largest plant. This is my first year growing lizard tail Orinoco and I’ve read that it’s a short variety with high nicotine which is good but next year I want to grow gold leaf Orinoco because it looks taller I love those huge gigantic plants like being in a super tall corn field when I was a child.
 

Knucklehead

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Ok this is great information I’ll pluck the suckers tomorrow afternoon, do you think if I hung and dried those branches the leaf would be any good? Cus if not I’d rather turn em into fermented plant juice if it’s not worth drying them. Ya I like the manual way also I’ve only ever grown a few plants before now so it didn’t really last long in our household so this is super exciting cus I’m use to buying sampsun leaf not really growing it and these leaves are huge compared to what I baught from Greece a while back. This is why earlier I was questioning weather or not the genetics were true but I bet it has something to do with environmental differences possibly. Otherwise I’ve grown a few Virginia gold plants that were just mammoth like and a kind of burley variety possible burley21 or burley21 cross, and a rustics variety that doesn’t get tall it probably got 3 feet tall maximum on the largest plant. This is my first year growing lizard tail Orinoco and I’ve read that it’s a short variety with high nicotine which is good but next year I want to grow gold leaf Orinoco because it looks taller I love those huge gigantic plants like being in a super tall corn field when I was a child.
The link from www.northwoodseeds.com has some nice photos of Samsun plants for comparison. His seed site is a nice resource for variety information. His name is Skychaser and he is a member of the forum.
Are you growing for cigarettes, pipe? Another oriental to consider is Prilep P66-9/7. The Prilep link:
 

Clatsopnehalem

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The link from www.northwoodseeds.com has some nice photos of Samsun plants for comparison. His seed site is a nice resource for variety information. His name is Skychaser and he is a member of the forum.
Are you growing for cigarettes, pipe? Another oriental to consider is Prilep P66-9/7. The Prilep link:
❤❤❤ definitely going to check them out for sure thank you so much I’m growing for both cigarettes and pipe and some point we want to build a facility to start growing fermenting aging cigar tobacco and eventually rolling cigars. But this is more of a long down the line dream goal otherwise we’re researching for burley types that are really tasty unlike some really bitter burley leaf types. Also Flue cured and sun cured leaf types so we want to air cure and sun cure until we can build a Flue barn and a proper air cure barn as well as cigar leaf area. Until then we want to try sun curing flue cure types and air curing them just for sake of using what we can for now and experimenting
 

Knucklehead

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❤❤❤ definitely going to check them out for sure thank you so much I’m growing for both cigarettes and pipe and some point we want to build a facility to start growing fermenting aging cigar tobacco and eventually rolling cigars. But this is more of a long down the line dream goal otherwise we’re researching for burley types that are really tasty unlike some really bitter burley leaf types. Also Flue cured and sun cured leaf types so we want to air cure and sun cure until we can build a Flue barn and a proper air cure barn as well as cigar leaf area. Until then we want to try sun curing flue cure types and air curing them just for sake of using what we can for now and experimenting
Look into Harrow Velvet and Golden Burley.

Cherry Red flue cured is great for cigarette or pipe.

You can cycle through quite a bit of leaf in a home built flue cure chamber, rather than a barn. It doubles as a kiln.
 

Clatsopnehalem

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About a gallons worth of sucker branches


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Sampsun plants are looking much better after cleaning them up and I thinned the clover yet again and watered 5 cups of on the fly chicken manure tea mixed with epsom salt I did 4 cups chicken manure compost, 2 cups epsom salt to 20 gallons of water. I have a concentrated chicken manure compost tea stealing right now so we can dilute it and use that to help with nitrogen for the next few feeds minus the epsom salt . I’m thinking we’re probably going to top all of the sampsun plants and let all of the lizard tail Orinoco plants go into seed but I’m only really thinking of doing that cus I am worried we won’t get much usable leaf from them due to late planting outdoors. I had the reverse idea of letting the sampsun plants get there tops and seed from the tops while clipping the Orinocos flower sights and just try to salvage what leaf can be produced. I have more lizard tail Orinoco seeds, but no more Black Sea sampsun seeds so maybe that’s the play but I’d like to hear y’all’s thoughts❤
 

Knucklehead

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Orientals are traditionally not topped. It helps to retain the mild familiar flavor.
Bagging your best plant that holds true to type will give you plenty of seed. Bag two for a plan B Murphy’s Law backup. You can top or not top but topping triggers a defense mechanism in the plant and the leaves become thicker and produce more nicotine as a response to what seems as an attack. They also freak out and want to produce more seed so after topping they produce suckers at every leaf node to produce more seed heads. Their whole purpose in life is to reproduce. Keep pulling them off for top quality main leaf.
I use five gallon paint strainers to bag my seed heads. I use a removable cable tie because you keep having to reposition the bag over the flower head as the flowers swell inside the bag. I use spinosad on the bud head right before I bag to help prevent bud worms. They eat the seed pods.
 

Clatsopnehalem

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Ok so this is good to know very well said ❤ Would it be crazy of me to bag all the sampsuns tops and just maintain plucking side shoots, and then I’ll get enough seed to share with all my extended family and if I clip the flower heads from the lizard tail Orinoco and just harvest them for leaf to smoke or maybe biomass to make fertilizer. I have like 2 grams of lizard tail Orinoco seeds still so maybe I just let the sampsuns seed and then all of them will maintain the lower nicotine and keep that traditional flavor like you say plus I feel bad topping them anyways cus the humming birds miss the flowers same with the bees❤ I’m starting to think I’d rather only let one strain go to flower each season now and still bagging there tops because I like to maintain genetic purity
 

deluxestogie

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enough seed to share with all my extended family
Must be a truly huge family. A single tobacco plant will produce up to ¼ million seeds. Each pod may give you several thousand seeds.

An issue to consider is that topping accelerates the maturation of the plant. You won't necessarily get more leaf when you top, but the leaves you do get will be more mature.

Bob
 

Knucklehead

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I’m starting to think I’d rather only let one strain go to flower each season now and still bagging there tops because I like to maintain genetic purity
Unlike corn, tobacco doesn’t pollinate by wind. Tobacco is pollinated by bees and/or self pollination. Bagging is to take bees out of the equation which leaves self pollination as the only means of pollination. If you bag a plant after buds appear but before they flower, the seed from that plant will be genetically pure. You can bag a plant of each variety and they can’t cross because bees can’t get to the flowers, each plant that is bagged will have to self pollinate.

edit: if you mistime your bagging and your best plant of a particular variety has a couple of flowers, just remove those flowers and their corresponding seed pods, then bag.
 
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Clatsopnehalem

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Oh ok so I’m starting to understand why only a single plant or maybe even just two of them need bagged for seed saving lol oh my ya I knew they made a lot of seed but ya wow so much I can’t see all my gigantic family needing that much seed hahaha. I really appreciate all of you thank you for the advice it’s been a huge help it took me forever to find the key forums so I apologize if I’ve continued to ask questions that are already posted lol please bare with my slowness ❤❤
 

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Clatsopnehalem

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Here’s today’s update things are kinda looking greener I think with the sampsuns and I had a few top leafs and one middle leaf start wilting but after spraying water on there foliage they perked back up. I’m hoping I don’t accidentally over fertilize.
 

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