Whole Leaf Tobacco

Hello from the UK

Propsjonnyb

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Hi , I’m John now retired and looking to get into rolling my own cigars at home since they have just become so expensive to buy and import. Suffice to say I am in the middle of applying for a Raw Tabacco License , which the government says I must have before I start to import any leaves whatsoever, so I have been exploring the forum , building my knowledge and identifying what I’ll need to start. A little family history , my great great grandfather was Peruvian and owned a Tabacco plantation , we don’t know much about this , but I was wondering if there were any Peruvian leaves available ? Or what blends to start with ?
I will be starting with the kits once I get the license, to add flexibility from WLT, as this I think will be the best way to keep the import bill down as the tax is a bit ridiculous £254 pound sterling per kilo. Are there any U.K. rollers already who hold any stock ? As the act doesn’t cover internal movements of leaves, but does cover manufacturing, so even if I could source the leaves I can’t roll a cigar until I hold a license!!
best regards

john
 

GreenDragon

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Hi John and welcome to the forum! There are a lot of really great rollers here on the forum with good videos and advice on how to get started.

"£254 pound sterling per kilo" (Jaw drops and scrapes across floor) WOW Have you considered growing?

Also, please settle the ongoing argument.... how do you pronounce Worcestershire????? :LOL:
 

Moth

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Welcome.
Im interested to hear about the progress of the HMRC application. A few forum members wrote about applying although no update for the response.
In think snuff doesn't need additional tax to be paid once you "manufacture" the raw tobacco, while making cigars would! There's an additional form for you to declare this.
Re: Worcestershire pronunciation, it's "wooster-shur" where I live (down south)
 

Beren

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Welcome, John! Sorry to hear about the oppressive UK rules! Things are not better here in Sweden. This may not do you any good with the impending Brexit but have you looked into the special rules concerning intra-EU trade? There is some ambiguity at the moment but whole leaf is generally considered to be a Farm Produce and are not taxed the same as processed tobacco (strips etc).
 

deluxestogie

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Welcome to the forum. There are a number of unusual tobaccos from Peru, and there are actual cigar tobaccos from Peru, though they seldom appear in the commercial market. From my study of the unique varieties acquired by the US Department of Agriculture's "Agricultural Explorers", who traveled throughout Peru during the early third of the 20th century, those varieties that were considered "cigar" varieties were locally called "Havana" tobacco, and was likely Vuelta Abajo derived seed from Cuba. Even the cigar type found cultivated on the high slopes of Huaina Picchu was named "Havana" by the family growing it.

Bob
 

Propsjonnyb

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Hi John and welcome to the forum! There are a lot of really great rollers here on the forum with good videos and advice on how to get started.

"£254 pound sterling per kilo" (Jaw drops and scrapes across floor) WOW Have you considered growing?

Also, please settle the ongoing argument.... how do you pronounce Worcestershire????? :LOL:
Wooorcest er shire
and unfortunately I don’t have that large a garden to grow anything , so I’m stuck with buying leaf
 

Propsjonnyb

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Worcester, Worcestershire, United Kingdom
Welcome.
Im interested to hear about the progress of the HMRC application. A few forum members wrote about applying although no update for the response.
In think snuff doesn't need additional tax to be paid once you "manufacture" the raw tobacco, while making cigars would! There's an additional form for you to declare this.
Re: Worcestershire pronunciation, it's "wooster-shur" where I live (down south)
Yes , just like the sauce!
The response time is ludicrous and ”manufacturing” as I read the act is included in the licensing
 

Propsjonnyb

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Worcester, Worcestershire, United Kingdom
Welcome, John! Sorry to hear about the oppressive UK rules! Things are not better here in Sweden. This may not do you any good with the impending Brexit but have you looked into the special rules concerning intra-EU trade? There is some ambiguity at the moment but whole leaf is generally considered to be a Farm Produce and are not taxed the same as processed tobacco (strips etc).
Hi inter EU trade is dependant in the classification and quantity , a few ounces might get though a a sample , but a few pounds or kilos would not (duty paid by weight of product) so a license is required to allow purchase and collect the duty payable
 

Propsjonnyb

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Worcester, Worcestershire, United Kingdom
Welcome to the forum. There are a number of unusual tobaccos from Peru, and there are actual cigar tobaccos from Peru, though they seldom appear in the commercial market. From my study of the unique varieties acquired by the US Department of Agriculture's "Agricultural Explorers", who traveled throughout Peru during the early third of the 20th century, those varieties that were considered "cigar" varieties were locally called "Havana" tobacco, and was likely Vuelta Abajo derived seed from Cuba. Even the cigar type found cultivated on the high slopes of Huaina Picchu was named "Havana" by the family growing it.

Bob
HI Bob , many thanks for this information , any little tit-bit like this is useful . Thanks
 

Charly

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Welcome to FTT,
you can also try to grow some tobacco in pots. It will give less tobacco per plant, but it's always more than nothing.
Good luck.
 

Ben Brand

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John.
I`ve seen Uk prices for cigars, and I think it`s rather cheap. Cheaper than South Africa, anyway. I`m immigrating to the UK next year, ( met my wife in the UK) and are quite excited about the cigar prices.
My sons stay in the UK and they buy cigars from someone on fb. At the current exchange rate a average cigar in SA cost about 14 pound, that`s just an average cigar, good cigars Padron`s etc if you can get hold of them are 25 pounds plus.
Enjoy.
Ben
 

Charly

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I have tried that route already Charly, I couldn’t grow enough to to make a pack of five!
You can perhaps buy or rent a small garden out of town ? With a little bit of luck, you can find some small spot for a decent price.
 

Propsjonnyb

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John.
I`ve seen Uk prices for cigars, and I think it`s rather cheap. Cheaper than South Africa, anyway. I`m immigrating to the UK next year, ( met my wife in the UK) and are quite excited about the cigar prices.
My sons stay in the UK and they buy cigars from someone on fb. At the current exchange rate a average cigar in SA cost about 14 pound, that`s just an average cigar, good cigars Padron`s etc if you can get hold of them are 25 pounds plus.
Enjoy.
Ben
Hi Ben , it’s not the price per se in U.K. , its the excise duty on any imported cigar from anywhere else , that’s the issue , recently I had 10 cigar samples , each cigar apx weight 12g., so 120g total duty to pay £64.00 . Almost twice as much as the cigars cost in the first place , so am now trying to get the license to make my own . Regards John
 

Beren

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Hi Ben , it’s not the price per se in U.K. , its the excise duty on any imported cigar from anywhere else , that’s the issue , recently I had 10 cigar samples , each cigar apx weight 12g., so 120g total duty to pay £64.00 . Almost twice as much as the cigars cost in the first place , so am now trying to get the license to make my own . Regards John
What country are you getting these samples from and are they for commercial or private us?

I am a law student getting my LLM in International Business Law at Univ of Liverpool. So your situation has motivated me to dig around with UK, German, Swedish and Dutch tobacco import rules.
 

Propsjonnyb

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What country are you getting these samples from and are they for commercial or private us?

I am a law student getting my LLM in International Business Law at Univ of Liverpool. So your situation has motivated me to dig around with UK, German, Swedish and Dutch tobacco import rules.
Hi Beren, USA and private consumption.
according to Custom & Excise. 10 cigars are the limit .
 

Beren

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Wow! I just went and read you rules. The U.K. Is generous with personal carriage purchased in EU, but anything else and your limits are very low, wiith no 'gift' allowance.

From what I read, the import licensing is for commercial resale use and you still pay the excise tax on it. What is the benefit for you?
 

Propsjonnyb

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Worcester, Worcestershire, United Kingdom
Wow! I just went and read you rules. The U.K. Is generous with personal carriage purchased in EU, but anything else and your limits are very low, wiith no 'gift' allowance.

From what I read, the import licensing is for commercial resale use and you still pay the excise tax on it. What is the benefit for you?
Hi , the main benefit is it allows me to buy raw Tabacco leaf and make my own cigars , since the duty is charged by weight , if I keep the limit low eg a lb or a 1/4 lb at a time, the duty charged is the only actual expense plus shipping. So it costs less per cigar than buying commercial ones’ when you work it out. If I tried to bring in any Tabacco leaves into the U.K. Without a RTL and UAN number , it would be seized and destroyed and I would pay serious penalties.
so I am keeping my fingers crossed and hope my application is successful in time.
 
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