Making Black Cavendish Pipe Tobacco

[DrBob]

dr bob's crock pot curing method is alive and well. Condensation on leaves is indeed caused by the leaves being below the dewpoint of the air in the chamber. the first fix for this problem is to add a circulation fan to maintain a constant temperature throughout the chamber. the second fix is to put a lid over the crockpot to reduce the water vapor emitted from the hot water in the crockpot.
I have also found that a poorly insulated curing chamber will have condensation on the top and this condensation will drip down on the tobacco.

 

[Smokin Harley]

I'm confused Dr Bob, you put a fan inside your crockpot???

 

[DrBob]

I'm confused Dr Bob, you put a fan inside your crockpot???[/QUOTE

 

[Smokin Harley]

Only reason I ask that is this post thread started as making cavendish which is steaming leaf as on a stovetop...whereas adding a circulation fan to a chamber denotes a kiln curing of leaf.
If you have experience making cavendish in or over a crockpot I'd like to know. I had asked the other day and maybe I'm confused about what I was told but I didn't think the crockpot would have the required temperature to properly steam the leaf. Just curious .

 

[DrBob]

I should have read the start of the thread.

 

[Smokin Harley]

No prob , Dr Bob...been there ,done that myself .

 

[deluxestogie]

I have not attempted to make Cavendish with a Crockpot. My impression is that a Crockpot, regardless of its size and power, will not generate enough steam to get the job done. Crockpots are designed to simmer.

Pot: colander: lid: dish-towel insulation. Boil (not simmer) 8 hours. Or...pressure cooker: colander: sealed lid. Pressure-cook 5 hours.

Bob

 

[Muskrat]

Try pressure cooker:colander:sealed lid. Bake in oven overnight at 170. You lose no water, and the process is completely odorless because the temp doesn't get high enough to force any steam out from under the pressure weight.

Works great on a tough piece of meat like a brisket; ends up still pink, but tender and juicy without being stringy. No colander or extra liquid required. The juices that come out of the meat will not evaporate, since the vapor has no place to go.

 

[Knucklehead]

Try pressure cooker:colander:sealed lid. Bake in oven overnight at 170. You lose no water, and the process is completely odorless because the temp doesn't get high enough to force any steam out from under the pressure weight.

Works great on a tough piece of meat like a brisket; ends up still pink, but tender and juicy without being stringy. No colander or extra liquid required. The juices that come out of the meat will not evaporate, since the vapor has no place to go.

Have you made Cavendish like this or just meat? It just seems like the tobacco would get soggy just like it is in his crock pot.

 

[deluxestogie]

Meat...tobacco. Almost the same thing. Some of the meat proteins begin to denature above 120ºF, which is a scalding temp for your hands.

[The handles of many pressure cookers are not rated for use inside an oven, though 170ºF is quite a bit below normal pressure cooker temps.] I would guess that a sealed container at 170ºF would work for Cavendish no better than a Crockpot.

If you pressure cook cauliflower for 1 minute, you get white soup. There's nothing left of the vegetable. Tobacco never tenderizes in the pressure cooker.

As demonstrated by the similarity in Cavendish processing times in a pot, vs. in a pressure cooker (8 hours vs. 5 hours), it's apparent that the greater heat of the pressure cooker plays only a small role here. The conversion to Cavendish seems to depend heavily on actual contact with steam.

Bob

 

[Muskrat]

I've not yet done it with tobacco. If 170 is too low, you could bump the temp up to 212, at which point there would be steam inside the pressure cooker, but it still could not escape, so again, there's no odor and you don't have to monitor the water level.

 

[deluxestogie]

Give it a try, and let us know how it works out.

Bob

 

[Muskrat]

I will once I've gotten some leaf to grow. Here it is deep into August and all I have to show for my efforts is one Goose Creek Red that's about a foot tall, one Black Mammoth about 2 inches tall, half a dozen nickel sized seedlings that were started in May, a dozen freshly germinated Virginia Gold seedlings, and a dozen dead seedlings.
Haven't yet figured out why one grows and the one next to it doesn't. I can make tomatoes sprout and grow just fine.
Thinking maybe it's the chloramine in the tap water I use to irrigate them, so I'm watering my latest seedlings with distilled water.

 

[Smokin Harley]

Picking up where I left off on Tuesday...the now 3 day old started cavendish that I had stored moist in a plastic baggie in the fridge smells like Latakia today. Still has a bit of hazelnut aroma too.

 

[ProfessorPangloss]

I've not yet done it with tobacco. If 170 is too low, you could bump the temp up to 212, at which point there would be steam inside the pressure cooker, but it still could not escape, so again, there's no odor and you don't have to monitor the water level.

Dont you kind of need the steam to escape? I could be wrong (& frequently am) but I think there would be enough pressure in a few quarts worth of steam (212 degrees, after all) to blow even a pressure cooker up in a catastrophic way. Especially if it was heating for a real long time.

 

[deluxestogie]

The weight on the pressure cooker value applies 15 psi, if I recall correctly. Above that, the steam hisses out.

Bob

 

[Smokin Harley]

Not sure why but after a total of 11 hours of steaming 7 hours on Tuesday and 4 yesterday, my cavendish is still brown, not black or even getting darker. Its about milk chocolate brown...over a rolling boil ,covered.Should I secure the lid tighter so steam doesn't escape as easily? Does it have to do with the varieties I'm using (Madole,Little Dutch and Black Mammoth)or am I just not steaming it long enough...
It does still smell like hazelnut and a dark caramel...which would be ok. I'd blend with that...but I'm going for that dark traditional black cavendish color and aroma and I'm just not getting it.

 

[deluxestogie]

The tobacco needs to be swaddled in steam--and the steam needs to escape somewhere. I've never figured out the core explanation for the transition to black. So every batch for me is a new experiment.

How about a photo of your setup?

Bob

 

[Smokin Harley]

I didn't take any pics, just a stainless steel spaghetti pot (about 1.5 gallons of water capacity under the steaming pot) with a tight fitting but shallow steam pot over it ,not a tight fitting lid but it gravity seals .
It was definitely steam swaddled...I lifted the lid to check water every hour on the first run but let it go without looking yesterday for a no-peek 3 hour session .
Thinking about running it one more time today about 5 hours,whats the harm , right?

 

[ProfessorPangloss]

2 thoughts:
maybe the colander and other leaves are screening some of the leaf. Notice any difference between top/bottom and outside/inside the pile?
if so, what about using a piece of window screen instead of colander for more steam exposure?

dont know.