Whole Leaf Tobacco

United Kingdom to end sales of whole leaf

Bex

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Just to further this discussion, as we are all in a flurry over here, wondering what to do.....First, there is an interesting post here, from Nothing2Declare. It appears that the new directive covers the entire genus - so not only tobacco plants, but ornamentals, as well. It is therefore going to be necessary for, for example, garden centers, etc., who have plants that 'die' to get a permit. Greater minds than mine are trying to see ways of getting around this. But the N2D is an interesting read:
http://nothing-2-declare.blogspot.ie/2017/01/guide-for-registering-for-purchasing_18.html
 

Bex

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I don't live in the UK (I live in Ireland), but it appears that most of the distributing being done here uses the UK as a hub. I am hoping that it may be possible to get shipments from the source, rather than distributor. Nevertheless, I am loading up (the regulation apparently goes into effect in July), and am taking my growing hobby a lot more seriously now.....
 

Bex

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My bad, as they say....I didn't get it until I read your response - I originally thought you were just a poor typist. Silly me, I get it now.....:)
 

Bex

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Just to continue this on, for any UK posters, it appears that the applications for the UK permits must be submitted by April 1 - of course, this means that these permits will not be processed, or the regulation in effect at that time. I don't know how long it will take in order for this process to be put in place, but the speculation is that it will be by July 1.
 

Paul

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Hi Bex,
I would not risk this optimistic interpretation.
I believe the April 1st date is not a deadline for applications, but the date on which the regulations come into force. People have been able to apply for approval since January. In fact, they can continue to apply at any time - there is no deadline. It may be that UK suppliers will attempt to continue to supply leaf to unregistered customers after that date, but without a specific communication from HMRC this will leave all parties open to prosecution. Perhaps there will be a chaotic few months while the industry adjusts (or closes), but anyone continuing to trade in this period would need to be very careful and understand the risk.
"From 1 April 2017 all businesses and individuals are prohibited from carrying on any activity involving raw tobacco unless they hold an approval from HMRC. Section 3 to section 6 of this notice cover the approval process, exemptions and the conditions and restrictions that apply to the approval, including the requirement to keep and produce records."
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/excise-notice-2003-tobacco-duty-the-raw-tobacco-approval-scheme/excise-notice-2003-tobacco-duty-the-raw-tobacco-approval-scheme#exemptions


 

Bex

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Yep, Paul, you're right. It's indicated here: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/excise-notice-476-tobacco-products-duty/excise-notice-476-tobacco-products-duty. I wonder, as UK suppliers are really distributors, rather than growers, if they intend to 'get around' this new regulation by distributing from their source, rather than the UK distribution point. If that was the case, then only the recipients would need to be concerned about this - and if they are receiving small packages through the post, how enforced this can be. Of course, frankly, all that this directive does is throw the whole thing into a black market industry.....
 

Paul

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I guess the UK companies could move/supply from offshore. But there are already suppliers inside and outside the EU who will happily send a pound of leaf (or more) in the post. They are much cheaper than UK leaf suppliers, so I don't think there is room for the current UK companies to act profitably as intermediaries. The major difference after April 1st is that importing leaf to the UK, or indeed simply possessing it, will no longer be legal (for most) and will attract a penalty if you are caught.
 

Charly

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For those who lives in France, can we still order leaves on wholeleaftobacco.com ? or does the new law prohibit sales to France too ?
Any advice ?

Thank you.
 

FmGrowit

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We've had success shipping to France, but I believe we've only shipped order of 1 or 2 pounds. It would be worth contacting your customs department and ask them what the policy is to import "unmanufactured tobacco, Tariff code 2401.10 for personal use." Also ask them if there is a weight limit and/or value limit.

If your customs department sites a specific law, please send me a copy so we can attach that law to the order in an attempt to educate the customs workers.

Ireland has been the most consistently uneventful country to ship to. Perhaps, someone, there might be interested in becoming our new distribution gateway into the EU.
 

Gavroche

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3 lbs... to me... and it was OK
Never exceed(overtake) no more than sixty euros of goods
ne Jamais dépasser plus de soixante euros de marchandises
 

greenmonster714

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Man, what ever happened over there in the UK? That new law is ridiculous. I could see something like that happening here in the states.
 
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Charly

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In France, we have a very simple law about tobacco : it's forbidden to buy tobacco on the internet, and it's forbidden to receive tobacco by mail.
If we want tobacco that is not available in France, we have to buy it physically in another country and bring it ourself to France, physically (and there are limitations about weight and quantities).

That's the law... but we have so few available tobaccos that it's hard not to try to order anyway.

I did order some manufactured tobacco, and some orders managed to arrive to me, but I also had one order that had been taken by the Customs who destroyed it (no other choice), it was tinned tobacco.

So if we order whole leaf, we are probably under the same law (I didn't find a specific point about manufactured versus not manufactured tobacco yet, but I will continue my investigations).

If I understand, we can still order whole leaves directly to you, on wholeleaftobacco.com, you are allowed to send it to France, but it might be kept by the Custom when it arrives.
If there is a chance to get your good leaves, it's worth it ;)
As we say : nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Don, can you confirm this ?
Thank you.
 

DistillingJim

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Charly - Does this apply even if buying from other EU countries? I've never tried them but have heard there are various WLT suppliers in eastern europe?
 

Charly

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Jim : it applies to all countries (even EU countries). From France the only legal way to get tobacco from another country is to go physically to this country and bring the tobacco with us... :(
Depending on which country you come back from, you have different limitations (quantities/weight), if I remember well, you can import a maximum of 250g of tobacco if you come from a country outside EU... :(
 

Bex

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Yep, it is an EU directive that 'tobacco products' cannot be posted from one EU country to another. There are some distributors who send their shipments to customers in small, non-descript packaging, but many, if it is within reason, use a courier service.
Sadly, the distributor that I was using has been unable to get the permit in order to continue business. It apparently was not an easy process. However, they seem to advise that other, possibly non-EU distributors (but still located in Europe) may be possible. Of course, again, you are just hoping that customs doesn't inspect your particular shipment.....
 
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