AmaxB
Well-Known Member
DonH about moisture
http://www.tobaccoscienceonline.org/doi/pdf/10.3381/0082-4623-44.1.51
http://www.tobaccoscienceonline.org/doi/pdf/10.3381/0082-4623-44.1.51
Curing Chamber from the box up My Build
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AmaxB
Well-Known Member
An excerpt
FLUE-CURED AGING
Description of the Flue-Cured Process
Before beginning a discussion of flue-cured aging, it may prove beneficial to review the flue-curing process. Proper curing is both a biological and a drying process. The mature tobacco leaf as it is harvested is a complex living system. It normally contains 80 - 90% water, 10-20% solids. About 25% of the solids is starch. The remaining 75% of the solids is made up of numerous biochemical compounds, pigments, minerals, cell tissues, etc.
Yellowing Stage
Depending on stalk position and degree of ripeness, the main goal is to remove moisture but without hindering biological processes. Oxygen is necessary for starch conversion, as well as enzymatic activity. About 20 - 30% of the water is removed during yellowing. If the tobacco is heated too quickly, the green color will set and enzymatic catalysis wiU be stopped. Process temperatures are from ambient to 100°F increasing two degrees an hour to 100°F.
Leaf Drying Stage
Leaf moisture between 40 - 50% must be achieved before temperature is increased above 130F. Starting temperature is at 100F carried through to 130F, increasing at about two degree increase per hour.
Stem Drying Stage
This is also called the killing out stage. The objective is to dry the stem. Major biochemical changes have ceased and temperature should not exceed 160F. Again, starting at around
130F increasing two degrees an hour to 160°F.
405000123
FLUE-CURED AGING
Description of the Flue-Cured Process
Before beginning a discussion of flue-cured aging, it may prove beneficial to review the flue-curing process. Proper curing is both a biological and a drying process. The mature tobacco leaf as it is harvested is a complex living system. It normally contains 80 - 90% water, 10-20% solids. About 25% of the solids is starch. The remaining 75% of the solids is made up of numerous biochemical compounds, pigments, minerals, cell tissues, etc.
Yellowing Stage
Depending on stalk position and degree of ripeness, the main goal is to remove moisture but without hindering biological processes. Oxygen is necessary for starch conversion, as well as enzymatic activity. About 20 - 30% of the water is removed during yellowing. If the tobacco is heated too quickly, the green color will set and enzymatic catalysis wiU be stopped. Process temperatures are from ambient to 100°F increasing two degrees an hour to 100°F.
Leaf Drying Stage
Leaf moisture between 40 - 50% must be achieved before temperature is increased above 130F. Starting temperature is at 100F carried through to 130F, increasing at about two degree increase per hour.
Stem Drying Stage
This is also called the killing out stage. The objective is to dry the stem. Major biochemical changes have ceased and temperature should not exceed 160F. Again, starting at around
130F increasing two degrees an hour to 160°F.
405000123
DonH
Well-Known Member
Thanks, Amax, that's helpful. I think I'll set the temps for the stem drying stage at 155 to make sure nothing in there is over 160.
AmaxB
Well-Known Member
Ha exactly what I did / am doing. Should be finished this evening or tomorrow.
AmaxB......
Questions (am too lazy to review 64 pages of posts)
Are you circulating air through the flue-curing chamber?
How much air, and how did you determine this?
How do you determine exhaust? per RH or wet/dry bulb monitoring?
Are leaf packed tight against chamber walls, forcing air through the leaf, or does it circulate around?
or are the leaf loosely placed in chamber (easy air flow)?
Questions (am too lazy to review 64 pages of posts)
Are you circulating air through the flue-curing chamber?
How much air, and how did you determine this?
How do you determine exhaust? per RH or wet/dry bulb monitoring?
Are leaf packed tight against chamber walls, forcing air through the leaf, or does it circulate around?
or are the leaf loosely placed in chamber (easy air flow)?
Go to Settings>>>>General Settings>>>>>Number of Posts per Page ----- You can set number of posts per page as high as 40. I have mine set on 40 and Amax has 17 pages instead of 64. I find it's alot easier than clicking on all those new pages and waiting for them to load.
Also it's easier to find old posts you want to refer to later. You know it's in there, but have to look to find it. Even faster is going to Archives at bottom right of every page. It shows all posts with no pictures. 40 posts per page, no pictures, searching is a breeze.
Perhaps, when the flue-curing season is over, we could prevail upon AmaxB to create a distilled summary of the theory, components, final build and results, including only essential photos, tables and charts. Even that is likely to run several pages. We can make it a sticky on building a fully implemented flue-cure chamber.
Bob
Bob
DonH
Well-Known Member
Naw, let's make him do it tonight!
end of season summary, build & results would be OK with me.
I started to design/build a flue-curing chamber last spring, but too much other things came up, and I decided to postpone this project for next year. Take your time, AmaxB.
I started to design/build a flue-curing chamber last spring, but too much other things came up, and I decided to postpone this project for next year. Take your time, AmaxB.
AmaxB
Well-Known Member
Your questions:
Are you circulating air through the flue-curing chamber? YES
How much air, and how did you determine this?The fan produces 160 CFM at 0" Static Pressure, 120 CFM at 0.5" Static Pressure (roughly 25 feet of 4" pipe), and 40 CFM at 1" Static Pressure (roughly 100 ft of 4" pipe). I've got about 12 feet of 4" duct with a restriction 3" duct 6 inches long on the heat box in. Being not overly educated in the area of math I assume I have a static of 0.5" +- a tad.
How do you determine exhaust? per RH or wet/dry bulb monitoring? My RH sensor and my Wet/Dry Bulb are very very close the sensor controls my venting I am using it.
Are leaf packed tight against chamber walls, forcing air through the leaf, or does it circulate around? If air is allowed to bypass the tobacco at all things won't work out, it must move through the leaves. I know this first hand all I've read said not to leave a gap, being hard headed I left one at the door. My yellowing phase had issues but things have been corrected, phase two meet the prescribed schedule, and the last phase is on track.
or are the leaf loosely placed in chamber (easy air flow)? The racks I reloaded 2/3rds through yellowing and are loaded snug.
Am stem drying now the leaf lamina that was not damaged by my screw up has dried a nice gold yellow.
For me the smell (drying the stem) is acceptable.
AmaxB
Well-Known Member
This could be done..
No NOT TONIGHT!!!Naw, let's make him do it tonight!
It would be at least a few pages but would have to wait until the coming winter or after my affiliated websites are finished and live on line. Have been working on the first of four the last few days. The theme
is aged fermented tobacco.
AmaxB
Well-Known Member
Half of the 1st batch was trash.....
Had more faith in my abilities than I should have on my first batch am now starting a second batch.
This time it is one variety not many and I will be following closely the Flue Curing How To I posted in a new thread the other day.
I'll be using the wet / dry bulb for this run noting where things are on the digitals.
The Chamber is good but the drive needs to understand what he is doing, kind-a like jumping on an old school dozer sticks an peddles
for the first time.
Had more faith in my abilities than I should have on my first batch am now starting a second batch.
This time it is one variety not many and I will be following closely the Flue Curing How To I posted in a new thread the other day.
I'll be using the wet / dry bulb for this run noting where things are on the digitals.
The Chamber is good but the drive needs to understand what he is doing, kind-a like jumping on an old school dozer sticks an peddles
for the first time.
Can you describe the good and bad qualities of the leaf that came out of the first batch? Photos?
Bob
Bob
workhorse_01
Well-Known Member
Amax which half was trash? I looked back to post #575, and if you checked the taste, and noted where it came from the pile, we can find out normal procedure for that tobacco. It is possible that one is a better air cured tobacco.
leverhead
Well-Known Member
If you only trashed half, you did better than I did on my first run! Getting all the bugs worked out isn't easy when it takes nearly a week to find them. Pictures would be great if you've got them, I've got no room to giggle.
AmaxB
Well-Known Member
I'll get some photos up...
What yellowed yellowed to a nice deep gold.
Some leaf went tan / L-Brown and is very thin like thin wrapping paper.
Some had scald
Had no Sponge or rot.
Temps, Humidity held high to long, mixing varieties not good, mixed age, mixed size, and Air Flow is good but had gaps.
If there is something to do wrong I did it.
I have a lot of Tobacco so I have plenty to run and learn, the goal - A great color and cured in the correct time frame.
I want perfect damn-it!
Think I covered last 3 post workhorse, leverhead, and delux
AmaxB
Well-Known Member
Photos 4 leaves
.
.
DonH
Well-Known Member
Your problems looked at lot like my first run except I had to trash 80%. And I'm having issues with my second run and the problem is I'm on the road and have to rely on my sophisticated high-tech control system: texting my wife and asking her what the readings are and asking her to make changes.
They look good to me. There's quite a bit of variance in the flue cured whole leaf that I've bought, and that was just in a single variety. Let it sit a few days and smoke it. That's the important part. Don't just go by color. Some of what I bought had variance in a single leaf just like the ones in the bottom pictures. I could be wrong, but I think you did better than you think you did.
AmaxB
Well-Known Member
This time through the Yellowing I am keeping Dry and wet 5F apart, currently Blower is on high to pull air through the leaf and Bulb Temps are 96F & 91F RH 83%
In 3 hrs & 10 min I will be 12 Hrs into yellowing
In 3 hrs & 10 min I will be 12 Hrs into yellowing
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