Another method of curing - Twist Rope

[squeezyjohn]

I think a lot of us who are trying to cure in less traditional (often more northern) climates often see alternatives that might make the process of getting the curing job done easier ... but invariably if you are watching it happen in a much warmer climate then the temperatures/humidity will not allow you to make the same product without mould problems.

The best solutions for hastening up the process are flue-curing or air curing in an indoors environment that can be controlled. If you lack the space or conditions for those solutions (as I do) stripping fully or partially colour cured leaf at the end of the natural curing season and processing in to carrotte or plug tobacco which take up a much smaller space than whole leaf hanging is a great way to go.

I never tire of watching these old sailors trying to make a carrotte (perique of tobacco - sic) which is how old sailors used to make their own supply of smoking tobacco from whole leaf which could be stored and aged in their cabins using only the rope skills of the sea.

 

[SmokesAhoy]

Dunno if it would ruin Turkish? Worth a try at any rate.

Gavroch, no they don't break it down into it's component pieces, it's twisted and wrapped the first time, then it is respooled onto another spool. Basically as the leaf cures it gives out more water making the rope not as compactly twisted together. As the transfer the rope from one spool to another they are twisting it at the same time so it becomes tight again.
Perhaps this could be done perique style, but without the added moisture where gravity was continually bearing down on it so as it gave up moisture and shrunk it would adjust automatically. I don't know though. The carotte method worked, but you must periodically give it a squeeze. You will feel it go from hard to soft. When soft it (my gut instinct only) needs to be re-tightened. That was what turned me off of it, the re wrapping of the carrotte is annoying, I can't see doing a whole lot of these.

Maybe letting the leaf get to a dryer case might be the answer, but the sticky juices mingling and turning black definitely gave it a good look/smell and that might not happen with the drier leaf. I'm in no way experienced here, but I'm very interested to see what more experiments bring about.

 

[Gavroche]

Yes SQ, i 'm ok with you but in my room with Checked(Controlled) atmosphere ? 40 ° and 80 % ?

 

[SmokesAhoy]

If fermenting try 49c and 70%

 

[Gavroche]

Thank You S.A

 

[deluxestogie]

Gavroche, Consider pressing tobacco that is yellow or brown using a Perique method within a container. (http://fairtradetobacco.com/threads/2873-Really-Easy-Perique-Press )

The final strength of the Perique is determined by the type of tobacco used. Mild tobacco makes a mild Perique. A 1 liter container will hold all the leaf from perhaps 4 plants, since it is compressed. When I do this, I remove most of each leaf stem, retaining only the stem at the leaf tip, to join the two halves.

Bob

 

[Gavroche]

Ok...

 

[ChinaVoodoo]

I'm testing out another method with a couple plants this year. You see, about 8 years ago I didn't pick the few plants I had grown because previous attempts at curing tobacco just resulted in it drying green and I had no resource for how to do it. So I left the plants standing in the garden. Spring came along and the leaves (a generic "Virginia" from a local seed shop) were all cured to a uniform, leathery, dark chocolate colour. The leaves were very elastic and I suspect they would have made a strong wrapper leaf. But here's the rub ; I had quit smoking and didn't try it. Fast forward to last year's crop, my friend picked and smoked Frog Eye Orinoco suckers that had been out all winter then reports to me they were excellent.

So I gotta see if this sun exposed, multiple freeze thaw cure is a thing worth exploring.

 

[Smokin Harley]

I think a lot of us who are trying to cure in less traditional (often more northern) climates often see alternatives that might make the process of getting the curing job done easier ... but invariably if you are watching it happen in a much warmer climate then the temperatures/humidity will not allow you to make the same product without mould problems.

The best solutions for hastening up the process are flue-curing or air curing in an indoors environment that can be controlled. If you lack the space or conditions for those solutions (as I do) stripping fully or partially colour cured leaf at the end of the natural curing season and processing in to carrotte or plug tobacco which take up a much smaller space than whole leaf hanging is a great way to go.

I never tire of watching these old sailors trying to make a carrotte (perique of tobacco - sic) which is how old sailors used to make their own supply of smoking tobacco from whole leaf which could be stored and aged in their cabins using only the rope skills of the sea.

Thats it , i'm going to try this.

 

[SmokesAhoy]

I've never heard of that China, the snow is not too rough on the leaf? I've got some suckers I can experiment on, if that worked... Holy crap would that be awesome. Never even considered it. I'm going to try!

 

[ChinaVoodoo]

I've never heard of that China, the snow is not too rough on the leaf? I've got some suckers I can experiment on, if that worked... Holy crap would that be awesome. Never even considered it. I'm going to try!

The bottom leaves were all rotten, but then again they probably already were before it snowed. I don't recall how much snow we had that year, but more than likely three feet ish. We get a lot of sun in the winter. The depth of winter is kinda like -25C, not a cloud in the sky, for a high and -35C for a low. I wonder if that stage of winter is doing something. I suspect though that most of the magic is spring and fall where it freezes and thaws every day for several months altogether.

 

[SmokesAhoy]

That's my winter almost exactly. There are a few plants I let sucker that didn't really get very big and if this makes spinach mush (which is what I believe will happen) is no loss. Nothing ventured nothing gained right?

I'll hang some whole stalk under eaves and leave some in the field unharvested, get 2 tests at the same time

 

[squeezyjohn]

Dunno if it would ruin Turkish? Worth a try at any rate.

Gavroch, no they don't break it down into it's component pieces, it's twisted and wrapped the first time, then it is respooled onto another spool. Basically as the leaf cures it gives out more water making the rope not as compactly twisted together. As the transfer the rope from one spool to another they are twisting it at the same time so it becomes tight again.
Perhaps this could be done perique style, but without the added moisture where gravity was continually bearing down on it so as it gave up moisture and shrunk it would adjust automatically. I don't know though. The carotte method worked, but you must periodically give it a squeeze. You will feel it go from hard to soft. When soft it (my gut instinct only) needs to be re-tightened. That was what turned me off of it, the re wrapping of the carrotte is annoying, I can't see doing a whole lot of these.

Maybe letting the leaf get to a dryer case might be the answer, but the sticky juices mingling and turning black definitely gave it a good look/smell and that might not happen with the drier leaf. I'm in no way experienced here, but I'm very interested to see what more experiments bring about.

I never felt I needed to tighten my carrotte that I made several years back - but it was bloody tight to start with. However the wrapping process was very labourious and I ended up with blisters on my hands from tightening the rope! I reckon that people looking to go down this route would be better off going for making a plug tobacco using a G-clamp or similar kind of jack/vice. The rope skills are nice and traditional though. I'm pretty sure the changes in the tobacco chemistry come from the pressure applied.

 

[squeezyjohn]

China - that is indeed fascinating and if true then goes against a lot of tobacco lore ... but that doesn't mean it won't work! Kinda like the tobacco version of canadian Ice Wine! Using the adverse conditions to your own advantage ... good job!

 

[ChinaVoodoo]

My thought was that, seeing as there is very little labour involved, and no curing shed requirement, that if this can consistently produce a unique but good product, it would be possible to make producing tobacco here as a business possible.

 

[SmokesAhoy]

Something this board has taught me is that the reason people do things one way is just because their environment was conducive to it, not because it's the only right way. We have so many examples of people doing things the wrong way but ending up with the right product, why not.

 

[deluxestogie]

My thought was that, seeing as there is very little labour involved, and no curing shed requirement, that if this can consistently produce a unique but good product, it would be possible to make producing tobacco here as a business possible.

(Emphasis mine.) If the leaf freezes while green, then it will be trash. If naturally sun-cured leaf is held above the ground so that rain and snow can drip off, it won't rot on the stalk. Then the only downside is that with each soaking, the leaf loses nicotine. If a wind comes up while the naturally sun-cured leaf is dry as toast, then you end up with tatters (or a leaf that is MIA).

So, if your climate gifts you with

• enough sun to color-cure the leaf before the first freeze
• precipitation that is insufficient to wash away all the nicotine
• only gentle breezes whenever the leaf is dry
• no prolonged warm, humid, overcast spells that would cause the cured leaf to mold

then you are in luck. And don't forget all the overwintering bugs and slugs. I would generalize to assert that the longer that harvestable leaf remains in the field, the greater the risk of loss. The shed is your friend.

Bob

 

[ChinaVoodoo]

Well, there's nothing like documenting the test of a hypothesis, so I'm gonna try it with several plants this year based on what I've experienced in the past. The suckers my friend smoked this spring were most assuredly green before freezing because I picked everything else that very evening as the sun was going down. It hit -5C that night. I can not remember the whole plants that I left in the garden years ago, and i can't say exactly how far up snow depth rotted the bottom leaves.

 

[deluxestogie]

Take lots of photos along the way.

Bob

 

[SmokesAhoy]

Come to think of it I have 2 suckers of a cigar variety that were harvested after a hard frost. They were dark green after thawing. They should be in the attic still. I'll take pics and edit them into this post after I wake up tomorrow (at work now).

They were from 2012, hard frost caught them, even the stalk was frozen.

Getting lighting was hard. these were babies, don't even know why I saved them. They are in the basement now taking on moisture, I'll roll a puro once ready, so normally the frost is mid sept, so these are basically exactly 4 years old, no idea when the green left them as I haven't thought about it till this discussion. I'll give an honest account of the flavor, should be ready tomorrow.




Heavy rain last night, got some flooding in the basement