Yultanman
Well-Known Member
What does your water start at? 900ppm seems high for seedling of just nutrients
Flowering stage - indoor growing
- Thread starter Bramleyjordan
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Here is who I would recommend in no particular order (that are more western London area):
Hounslow- Slims- Great location and have been around for years. Slim is top notch.
GroWell (Merton & Wembley)- Many locations though in England. Very knowledgeable team.
Go Grow (Edgware area)- Sam may still be there. Good people as well.
Hounslow- Slims- Great location and have been around for years. Slim is top notch.
GroWell (Merton & Wembley)- Many locations though in England. Very knowledgeable team.
Go Grow (Edgware area)- Sam may still be there. Good people as well.
The water is taken into account. For example, if water is 200, add 700 fertilizer for a total of 900 for burley. Here’s a post from BigBonner about float tray systems in his greenhouse. His meter reads in .9, mine reads in 900.
Tell me about float tray systems
I know some of you big guys use float trays. Tell me about them! I only grow about 100 plants a year but am really thinking I might benefit by switching to them. Also, the float trays I see advertised that hold about 50 to 90 some plants, are they the same thing you guys use? or is the...
Yultanman
Well-Known Member
The water is taken into account. For example, if water is 200, add 700 fertilizer for a total of 900 for burley. Here’s a post from BigBonner about float tray systems in his greenhouse. His meter reads in .9, mine reads in 900.
Tell me about float tray systems
I know some of you big guys use float trays. Tell me about them! I only grow about 100 plants a year but am really thinking I might benefit by switching to them. Also, the float trays I see advertised that hold about 50 to 90 some plants, are they the same thing you guys use? or is the...fairtradetobacco.com
if you are reading ppm and him ec (which i think) then you are running 1.41 not .9
Yultanman
Well-Known Member
@Knucklehead But if it works and doesn't burn you’re doing it right
Bramleyjordan
Well-Known Member
31 miles away from me
Bramleyjordan
Well-Known Member
Not going to lie, this sounds foreign to me
31 miles away from me
Rootzone in Green Business Centre, The Causeway, Staines upon Thames, may be a good option too. I haven't visited them myself. So, I can't speak to what to expect.
Esoteric in Guildford may be another option as well. Once again, I haven't visited them myself.
I did put a message out to one of my buddies who is a distributor of garden products over there. If I hear back, I'll shoot you more specific info if I can.
Bramleyjordan
Well-Known Member
Amazing! Thank you sir
No burn, but that might explain the frequent haircuts.
2015 Knucklehead Grow Blog
The plastic sticks certainly last longer than wood Popsicle sticks. I've found that on the smooth plastic tag surface of my bed labels, Sharpie permanent marker will often rub off completely with a dry paper towel. Since I use so many sticks for my seedlings, I go with the wood Popsicle sticks...
When did I say the plant is 30cm?
Why would anyone do that?.Get a bigger bulb.
Fake replicas will burn the plants.There's a reason they're £50 and not £800.
Bramleyjordan
I'd take most of this with a pinch.Get some help from the grow shops but they'll say you need a lot of the most expensive stuff.And don't use hydro stuff in soil,get some growth stage organic feed that's meant for soil if you're going to do it in soil.And decent seedling potting mix to start the seeds off in.
I'd take most of this with a pinch.Get some help from the grow shops but they'll say you need a lot of the most expensive stuff.And don't use hydro stuff in soil,get some growth stage organic feed that's meant for soil if you're going to do it in soil.And decent seedling potting mix to start the seeds off in.
Yultanman
Well-Known Member
when you recommended a light with a 30cm penetration
because that is how you get light to lower portions. A bigger bulb will provide more light to the top.without good penetration and taking into account the inverse square law on a tall plant cfl is just not the first choi
Having at least 15 Chinese leds i can tell you youre wrong. Some are better than others but light doesnt just burn your plants. Poorly used/placed light does. The plant certainly cant tell whether its a brand name light or not
anyways thats my experience having used all market options currently available.
Yultanman
Well-Known Member
any chance of an explanation as to why not use hydroponic nutrients in soil? Unless you are organically certifying your end product i see no reason why not but if you have one please share.
they have limited build up and flush easily and the feed routine can be customized. What does the organic feed offer over and above this?
Yultanman
Well-Known Member
because i believe in proof please show me the light burn on my plants. Entire year and 1/2 life through at least 5 good harvests only under chinese led. And this one is new to me with the quantum style board in the last 2 months. Before that on a blurple
(Please note that they just got harvested and a haircut. Usually the foliage fills the tent)
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No I didn't
So 100w would be the same as 1000w?.There's a reason there are bigger bulbs.
Again when did I say chinese lights?.I said chinese sellers on ebay & amazon.Almost everything nowadays is made in china or taiwan,fake or not.
Google it.
I don't know what organic has to do with what I said.And some hydro nutrients are now classed as organic.
The same as before,chinese fake ebay & amazon sellers.
This is the last post I'm writing on this thread.All of the info provided is based on my experience from the past 15-20 years.@Bramleyjordan if you go down the LED route,make sure it's a real brand or make.The link you posted isn't a real one,I've helped countless others that had trouble with lighting & it was always down to fake knock off types.Remember £50 vs £800,why would that be?
Yultanman
Well-Known Member
You said to only use organic not hydroponic.i asked why. Thats what it has to do with it
saying: Google it is not providing information.
I provided 3 reasons why using hydro nutrients could be beneficial. I can also tell you that where i am there are no agricultural producers that grow with organic only fertilizer unless they are certifying.
Anyways agreed, at this point it is a religious debate and the thing is: there are many ways to skin a cat
This might be none of my business but I just have to say that I’m impressed with both @Yultanman and @3437 for the civility in which you demonstrated in what must have felt like a rather passionate debate. It remained a debate and never devolved into a tweetering on Facebook style personal attack. Thank you for that.
I admit to knowing exactly zero about what either of you was talking about. I’ve started seed with undercabinet fluorescent lighting and managed to keep them alive long enough to punt that football to Mature Nature by sticking them outside in a patch of dirt under sunlight. I don’t know anything about the equipment or the methods of inside growing or how that equipment and those methods have evolved over the years.
Anyhow, I only have the one MVP Sportsmanship Award so you guys will have to share. Congratulations.
I admit to knowing exactly zero about what either of you was talking about. I’ve started seed with undercabinet fluorescent lighting and managed to keep them alive long enough to punt that football to Mature Nature by sticking them outside in a patch of dirt under sunlight. I don’t know anything about the equipment or the methods of inside growing or how that equipment and those methods have evolved over the years.
Anyhow, I only have the one MVP Sportsmanship Award so you guys will have to share. Congratulations.
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Yultanman
Well-Known Member
@Knucklehead thanks... just trying to provide information not scrap lol!!
And in the vein of more info: pic taken from this page because it was clear and detailed https://manicbotanix.com/plant-canopies-light-and-photosynthesis/
The inverse square law explained and why just upping your wattage from a 100 to a 1000w doesnt work. As such “interlighting” or ganging up is technique often used with cfl and other indoor grow lights
this is because everytime the light distance is doubled the light is 1/4. Tobacco, being a tall plant is very susceptible to this in an indoor setting
the reason you cant just “get a bigger bulb” is you burn the plants (as @3437 experienced and blamed the cheap lights).
If the 100w lightsource (we wont delve into par for now) provides the required light at 12” away lets call it 100 lumens for easy numbers at 24” it is only providing 25lumens. At 48” it is providing about 6.25 lumens. now if you amp up that bulb size, say to a 1000w you are nuking the top with 10x its needs, 2.5x its needs at 24” and 48” is getting about the right about of light maybe a little low at 62.5 of the original 1000 lumens.
You can see how there is challenge to growing tall plants indoors. Its all about compromise and understanding the physics behind what you are doing. Most indoor crops are trained to an even canopy to minimize this compromise and keep the produce in the ideal zone. Lights are ganged to create an even distribution of this correct amount of light across the canopy and in some cases to get light to lower portions of a plant
see in my picture here i am ganging up two lights running at only 40% to get the required spread and correct amount of light. I didnt just turn 1 light to 80%
And in the vein of more info: pic taken from this page because it was clear and detailed https://manicbotanix.com/plant-canopies-light-and-photosynthesis/
The inverse square law explained and why just upping your wattage from a 100 to a 1000w doesnt work. As such “interlighting” or ganging up is technique often used with cfl and other indoor grow lights
this is because everytime the light distance is doubled the light is 1/4. Tobacco, being a tall plant is very susceptible to this in an indoor setting
the reason you cant just “get a bigger bulb” is you burn the plants (as @3437 experienced and blamed the cheap lights).
If the 100w lightsource (we wont delve into par for now) provides the required light at 12” away lets call it 100 lumens for easy numbers at 24” it is only providing 25lumens. At 48” it is providing about 6.25 lumens. now if you amp up that bulb size, say to a 1000w you are nuking the top with 10x its needs, 2.5x its needs at 24” and 48” is getting about the right about of light maybe a little low at 62.5 of the original 1000 lumens.
You can see how there is challenge to growing tall plants indoors. Its all about compromise and understanding the physics behind what you are doing. Most indoor crops are trained to an even canopy to minimize this compromise and keep the produce in the ideal zone. Lights are ganged to create an even distribution of this correct amount of light across the canopy and in some cases to get light to lower portions of a plant
see in my picture here i am ganging up two lights running at only 40% to get the required spread and correct amount of light. I didnt just turn 1 light to 80%
Yultanman
Well-Known Member
Oh and the reason this law doesnt seem to affect outdoor growers is that the formula is based on the distance from the light source. The sun, being however zillion miles away, the distance to the plant will never get doubled or even 1/4 etc so the inverse law ends up being so minuscule that we dont consider it.
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